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1552885
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December 13, 1974 - Ford, Senator Barry Goldwater
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1552885
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document
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December 13, 1974 - Ford, Senator Barry Goldwater
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collections
Memoranda of Conversations (Nixon and Ford Administrations)
Ford Administration Memoranda of Conversations
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Arms control
Federal budget
National security
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13
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1974-12-13
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12
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1974
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13
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1974-12-13
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12
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1974
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File scanned from the National Security Adviser's Memoranda of Conversation Collection at the Gerald R. Ford Presidential Library
NATIONAL ARCHIVES AND RECORDS ADMINISTRATION
Presidential Libraries Withdrawal Sheet
WITHDRAWAL ID 017773
REASON FOR WITHDRAWAL
National security restriction
TYPE OF MATERIAL
Memorandum of Conversation
TITLE
Ford, Senator Barry Goldwater
CREATION DATE
12/13/1974
VOLUME
2 pages
COLLECTION/SERIES/FOLDER ID
031400321
COLLECTION TITLE
National Security Adviser. Memoranda of
Conversations
BOX NUMBER
7
FOLDER TITLE
December 13, 1974 - Ford, Senator Barry
Goldwater
DATE WITHDRAWN
05/11/2004
WITHDRAWING ARCHIVIST
GG
Sanitizal 12/6/04
Approved For Release 2004/12/06 NLF-MUC-7-13-1-5
MEMORANDUM
THE WHITE HOUSE
WASHINGTON
CONFIDENTIAL/SENSITIVE
MEMORANDUM OF CONVERSATION
PARTICIPANTS:
President Ford
Senator Barry Goldwater
Lt. General Brent Scowcroft, Deputy Assistant
to the President for National Security Affairs
DATE AND TIME:
Friday, December 13, 1974
9:00 a.m.
PLACE:
The Oval Office
The White House
The President: I wanted to talk to you about the Vladivostok agreement.
Interesting Scoop is becoming a dove on the issue. The complaints are
coming from those who say we should have gone lower with the ceilings.
Our proposal stemmed from three NSC meetings and was basically the
JCS wish for equal aggregates.
What have we given up, and what have they ? Our program is under
2, 400. We can get up there by keeping our B-52s or we can add the
Trident and B-1. The Soviet Union has about 2, 550 now, so they will
have to cut back. They have no MIRVs yet but they are already testing
now. Their program as estimated
is substantial, so this is for
25X1
them a cutback. We got them to drop FBS and the British and French
missile forces. So it seems to us, the JCS, and Schlesinger that this
is a good program and required more concessions by them than by us.
Goldwater: When I made my comments I hadn't heard the details.
I basically am not concerned about the nuclear field; I am basically
concerned about the conventional. The Soviet Union is passing us.
I have the same feeling I had in the '30's. I see trouble in the Middle
East, not only over Israel. I hope we stay out of it. I don't want to
see you not being able to react to a conventional threat.
CONFIDENTIAL/SENSITIVE
TOP SECRET = XGDS (3)
CLASSIFIED BY: HENRY A. KISSINGER
Presidential Library Review of NSC Equities is Required
DECLASSIFIED, with portions exempt
AUTHORITY RAC Review 12/6/04 guidilines
BY In
NLF, DATE 4/13/07
Approved For Release 2004/12/06 : NLF-MUC-7-13-1-5
CONFIDENTIAL SENSITIVE
- 2 -
The President: Secretary Kissinger says the same thing.
Goldwater: Five out of six in the new Congress want to cut the
military. It's just like the 1930's.
The President: We're having a meeting tomorrow on the DOD
budget. I am leaning to the higher figures.
I heard that Scoop would submit a resolution that we should renego-
tiate the Vladivostok agreement. I would hope for an amendment
that would force them to vote for $3-5 billion more a year if we
don't get it. The Navy is in bad shape.
Goldwater: The Navy also has obsolete thinking.
The President: We also need to keep up R&D.
Goldwater: Schlesinger is one of the best we have come across. If
you can come up with a better one, okay, but he tells it straight.
The President: I have no present intention to do so.
Goldwater: We don't need the FB-111 if we have the B-1. And
we need the A-7 like tits on a bull. The Soviets have never scrapped
the Badger. I don't want us to get into a war like the 1930's.
The President: It will be over my dead body.
Goldwater: The big thing is to build up the Navy. We have too many
missiles. We need only a couple of standard types. We are thinking of
a committee on procurement in the Congress. It is terrible. The
Pentagon is fifty percent over-staffed. Every office has a PIO [Public
Information Officer]. It is over-staffed and over-organized. I would
tell Schlesinger to get to work--cut the size, reorganize, and move
people out. The PACAF closure was a good move.
The President: We didn't get much flak from the base closings.
Goldwater: I'm sorry to see Saxbe go, but I knew he wants to be an
Ambassador more than Jesus Christ. Just don't put Goodell in.
The President: I have no intention of doing that.
CONFIDENTIAL/SENSITIVE
NATIONAL ARCHIVES AND RECORDS ADMINISTRATION
Presidential Libraries Withdrawal Sheet
WITHDRAWAL ID 017774
REASON FOR WITHDRAWAL
National security restriction
TYPE OF MATERIAL
Memorandum of Conversation
TITLE
Ford, Senator Barry Goldwater
DESCRIPTION
Brent Scowcroft's handwritten version
of memcon
CREATION DATE
12/13/1974
VOLUME
2 pages
COLLECTION/SERIES/FOLDER ID
031400321
COLLECTION TITLE
National Security Adviser. Memoranda of
Conversations
BOX NUMBER
7
FOLDER TITLE
December 13, 1974 - Ford, Senator Barry
Goldwater
DATE WITHDRAWN
05/11/2004
WITHDRAWING ARCHIVIST
GG