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October 11, 1976 - Ford, Kissinger, Israeli Foreign Minister Yigal Allon
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1553555
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October 11, 1976 - Ford, Kissinger, Israeli Foreign Minister Yigal Allon
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Memoranda of Conversations (Nixon and Ford Administrations)
Ford Administration Memoranda of Conversations
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Israel
Lebanon
Syria
Egypt
Soviet Union
Munazzamat al-Tahrir al-Filastiniyah.
Middle East conflicts
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1976-10-11
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1976
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1976-10-11
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1976
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MEMORANDUM
THE WHITE HOUSE
WASHINGTON
SEGRET/NODIS/XGDS
MEMORANDUM OF CONVERSATION
PARTICIPANTS:
President Ford
Yigal Allon, Deputy Prime Minister and
Minister of Foreign Affairs of Israel
Dr. Henry A. Kissinger, Secretary of State
Simcha Dinitz, Israeli Ambassador to the U.S.
Brent Scowcroft, Assistant to the President
for National Security Affairs
DATE AND TIME:
Monday, October 11, 1976
10:30 a. m.
PLACE:
The Oval Office
The White House
[The press was admitted. There was small talk, including vague
references to the arms decision. The press left.
BY. NSC MEMO, 11/24/98, STATE DEPT. GUIDELINES 3/13/04 stockiview3/13/04
The President: Were you one of Henry's pupils?
Allon: Yes I was - - but don't blame him.
E.O. 12958, SEC. 3.5
NARA, DATE 7/13/04
Kissinger: He and Ecevit were in the same class. It was 1956.
The President: It is good to see you again. I would like to visit the
area after the present problems are over, the sooner the better.
DECLASSIFIED
I would like your appraisal of Lebanon and what you think is going
to happen.
Allon: From the beginning, we coordinated closely with Henry.
Many of our early predictions have come true. It appears that
neither side has the means to prevail. Until February the Syrians
SECRET/NODIS/XGDS
CLASSIFIED BY Henry A. Kissinger
EXEMPT FROM GENERAL DECLASSIFICATION
SCHEDULE OF EXECUTIVE ORDER 11652
EXEMPTION CATEGORY 5 (B) (1, 3)
AUTOMATICALLY DECLASSIFIED ON Imp. to det.
File scanned from the National Security Adviser's Memoranda of Conversation Collection at the Gerald R. Ford Presidential Library
SEGRET/NODIS/XGDS
-2-
backed the radicals, but when they wouldn't support the February
compromise, the Syrians began to back the Christians who had been
on the ropes. We realized this was only a tactical move on their
part, so we provided Soviet arms and some of our old a:ms to the
Christians. They fought very well.
Kissinger: You recall we were afraid if Syria beat the Palestinians
and radicals they would turn on the Christians.
Allon: Once the situation changes, we are afraid the Syrians will once
again back the radicals against the Christians after all the Ba' athists
are Arab radicals. The PLO itself is in a great mess. There has been
a massacre of PLO. Only the Arabs are killing the PLO. Syria wants
to replace the PLO leadership to get people they can control.
Kissinger: That is not against our interest.
Allon: I am just stating the facts. They want to replace Arafat and all
the others. We understand the Soviet Union may be going along with the
Syrians.
Kissinger: We have a report that the Soviet Union has cut off Syrians
spare parts. They are very clumsy. Syria won't forget -- you can't
humiliate Arabs.
Allon: If the PLO is destroyed, the Soviets will have lost a great vehicle
to intervene in the Middle East. It is hard to understand why they are
doing it. Even their moves toward us are clumsy, because they are
playing a more and more minor role.
In South Lebanon we have opened some border points to cooperate
with the Lebanese Christians. It has made a good impact on the Arabs.
We have unofficial contacts with the Shia minority also. It is very
quiet in Southern Lebanon, and the PLO's attempts to return to there and
to close the border points are being resisted by the local people themselves.
The President: How about the airfields?
Allon: We saw one night landing there. We are trying to get more
information. The other one is farther north. We can hit with artillery
the South one, but we don't want to cross the border at all.
FORD
so
SECRET/NODIS/XGDS
GERALD
SEGRET/NODIS/XGDS
-3- -
Kissinger: They aren't using the fields very much.
Allon: Iraq is very active with the help of Egypt. I don't understand them
because if the PLO is a threat to anyone, it's a threat to Egypt.
Kissinger: Egypt wants to break its isolation and the hatred between
Sadat and Asad is extreme now.
Allon: There are now over 5, 000 Iraqis in Lebanon, who got there
through Egypt. We are watching the situation now. There is an attempt
for an Arab summit but they can't agree on Sarkis or Hussein.
Our estimate, is that because of the deep disappointment of Syria
and West Bankers in the PLO even the radical West Bankers are
queuing up to visit Amman -- it is not excluded that Syria will back some
Jordan/Palestinian negotiation to go around the Rabat decision.
Dinitz: They won't repudiate Rabat, but just get some negotiation going
with Jordan.
Allon: In this crazy Middle East, this could happen.
I hear from Henry the Soviets are propagating the idea of a Geneva
Conference, first without the PLO and then will the PLO in one of several
negotiating groups. So I told Gromyko thank you, but not the PLO in any
forum or arrangement. I am not going to respond officially to the Soviet
Union but I called attention to a passage of my UN speech.
Kissinger: Interestingly enough, no Arab has responded. Let's see what
they do.
Allon: The next couple of years will be decisive in the Middle East, so
there is one crucial point I want to raise -- defensible frontiers. We
would like to be able to defend ourselves by ourselves, so we need some
changes in the Green Line. I will discuss this with Henry, but I wanted
you to know tha t even moderate people in Israel will insist on the ability
to defend. We know with whom we are dealing. I wrote an article in
Foreign Affairs. I was trying to say that the terrain is important even
in the modern age.
SECRET/NODIS/XCDS
SECRET/NOD IS/XGDS
-4-
The President: You talk to Henry about it. I am interested in hearing
what you propose.
Allon: We have differences among ourselves, but the debate is about
giving less, not more.
The President: Is there anything else we should discuss?
Allon: With your permission. We are very grateful for the equipment
you have agreed to give us. I hope the bureaucracy will be urged to
proceed expeditiously.
I know your budget is being formulated. I would hope that you
could tell your people not to reduce the budget below $1. 5 billion plus
$750 million in economic aid. If I could tell my Prime Minister you
are considering favorably the idea of granting this much aid, it will be
as good news as the arms decision itself.
The President: We are not really in that cycle yet -- I haven't seen
either our defense budget or the aid budget. You know my record, and
all I can say now is we will do the best we can. I don't want to mislead
you, but I will do my best.
Allon: One other thing we have pressed for years, with the former
President as well. It is a small point for you to have to deal with but
it is big for us. That is additional landing rights. It would be especially
helpful to get them in Miami because we have fortunately -- and amazingly
gotten them in Mexico City. That is being inaugurated in November, and
it is an interesting change in our relationship.
The President: How would you do it otherwise?
Allon: Through Montreal. It would be a logistical difficulty.
Kissinger: You would reciprocate with Beersheba.
Allon: Or Sharm el-Sheikh. That, incidentally, was very helpful for
Entebbe.
The President: Congratulations on that operation. It was great. Was
the television story fairly accurate?
SEGRET/NODIS/XGDS
SEGRET/NODIS/XGDS
-5-
Dinitz: It was.
Allon: If you could consider favorably the landing rights
The President: It hasn't come to me but I will talk to Henry about it.
Have you met the new Mexican President?
Allon: No. He was out campaigning when I was there.
The President: I was very impressed with him. I think he can do a lot
to straighten out Mexico, especially economically.
Allon: We are doing fairly well in Latin America.
There is an improvement also in Africa. After Angola they got
scared, and they are very disappointed in the Arab oil producers.
The President: They should. Henry has done a superb job in pulling
these people together.
[General scussion of the difficulty of negotiating with Africans and
the gulf between their public and private utterances.
Kissinger: But even though they contradict themselves and don't keep
their promises, they are moving toward you [Israel] and toward a
settlement on Rhodesia. For example, they have gotten rid of Muzorewa
but the British say he has to be there. At some point we have to say
no further.
Allon: What about South Africa? That is a momumental problem.
Kissinger: It is indeed. But success in Rhodesia and Namibia will
at least buy us some time to work on it.
SECRET/NODIS/XGDS
P/allon
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DECLASSIFIED
E.O. 12958, SEC. 3.5
NSC
MEMO,
11/24/98,
STATE
DEPT.
state
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3/13/04
BY
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