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This file includes comments on Henry Kissinger.
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1511425
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Lake, Anthony (National Security Council) - Interview, 10/28/77
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1511425
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Lake, Anthony (National Security Council) - Interview, 10/28/77
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This file includes comments on Henry Kissinger.
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A. James Reichley Interview Transcripts
Foreign Policy Interviews
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Vietnam War, 1961-1975
Vietnamization
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1970-12-31
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1970
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The original documents are located in Box 1, folder "Lake, Anthony - Interview, 10/28/77"
of the A. James Reichley Interview Transcripts at the Gerald R. Ford Presidential Library.
Copyright Notice
The copyright law of the United States (Title 17, United States Code) governs the making of
photocopies or other reproductions of copyrighted material. Gerald R. Ford donated to the United
States of America his copyrights in all of his unpublished writings in National Archives collections.
Works prepared by U.S. Government employees as part of their official duties are in the public
domain. The copyrights to materials written by other individuals or organizations are presumed to
remain with them. If you think any of the information displayed in the PDF is subject to a valid
copyright claim, please contact the Gerald R. Ford Presidential Library.
Digitized from Box 1 of the A. James Reichley Interview Transcripts at the Gerald R. Ford Presidential Library
AMOUNT AND RECORDS
Gerald R. Ford Library
1000 Beal Avenue Ann Arbor, Michigan 48109-2114
1985
RESTRICTION ON QUOTATION
AND REPRODUCTION
Quotation
Researchers may not use direct quotes from these
interviews without written permission of the donor,
Mr. A. James Reichley. Mere citation of information
from the interviews is allowed, however. Mr.
Reichley's address is available upon request.
Reproduction
Researchers must photocopy this notice and staple
it to each interview copied.
August 1, 1991
A Presidential Library Administered by the National Archives and Records Administration
brismi,
Interview with Anthony Lake, October 28, 1977.
FORD & LIBRARY GERALD
(He
had
Lake worked with the National Security Council under Henry Kissinger,
sepai specific responsibility for Vietnam. He feels that Kissinger and Nixon
when they came into office had a common view of the world, atx though not a precise
strategym Lake feels that this is natural and desirable jext The thinks it takes
about a year of an administration being in office really to work out a strategy»
and He the thinks that this was the case with the Nixon administration. He says that
he thinks that Nixon and Kissinger came in with a lot of thoughts, a lot of views
a
of the/general kind on issues, but they then had tothink through a strategy which
SIP
they in large part did. After all, Lake says, circumstances change rapidly in
2020
foreign affairs and to go in with a prethoughtout strategy would not be a very
effective way of dealing with the problems that arise. Lake points out that the
Nixon doctrine, the structure of peace, the pentagonal balance where all strategies had
That
emerged after Nixon had been in office for some time althogh these reflected the
view of the world that Nixon and Kissinger had brought with them into the
administration.
As far as Vietnam goes, Lake feels that Niven hoped to accomplish a lot through
vrnm the Moscow connection, connection, and later through Peking as well. Lake thinks that the
agreement that was finally worked out in 1973 for withdrawal from Vietnam could
have been achieved much earlier, but he acknowledges thatKissinger differs with
him on this. Lake says that the Nixon and Kissinger strategy, such as it was, Was
strey set forth in the various state of the world messages. He thinks that it was
not a necessarily a coherent, unified strategy but he is not critcal of them for this
He he says that any single strategy for R dealing with foreign affairs would be doomed
from the start. Lake does not feel that Nixon and Kissinger had a particular
consciousness of managing the withdrawal of the United States power from the world&
He he thinks that à this is the crucial question about the Nixon-Kissinger approach
this/
was whether/they had in mindx He 's not fully certain on it himself. He thinks that
they did recognize that the United States was living in a different kind of world that
- 2 -
they would have to make adjustments to deal with this changed situation. They
felt that American power had been reduced from what it had been in the earlier
period following the war. Lake thinks that Nixon felt that this was due more
to internal thamextermal than to externalcauses) he thinks that Nixon and
Kissinger recognized the reduction in American willingness to support a large
FORD & GERALD LIBRARY
world role but he thinks that they were more limited in their recognition of
the? changes in the outside world itself. Vietnamization, Lake says, was
designed to deal withthis change, more to satisfy the fall of domestic support
Vram
for
a
prolong policy than because of the situation in Vietnam. Lake
feels that the invasion of Cambodia in 1970, and the Christmas bombings in 72
show that Nixon really wanted to carry out a much more aggressive policy in
and that
Vietnam than he felt that he had the country's support for itx/he would have
would be
carried this out if he thought that he had been able to gather enough political
support to do it. Lake says that Daniel Ellsberg argues that it was always
the plan of the administration to R take the action that it ultimately took
in 1972,
but Lake himself does not believe that this is true.
the
vr
Plans for escalating the war were always/lying on to shelf, Lake says,
but they wre taken off the shelf only when Nixon W felt that the situation
had become such that there was no other way for him to deal with it. Lake
said that in the time that he was in the National Security Council he was
opposed tothe approach that became known as "Vietnamization" me was in
favor of making more concessions, not for simply withdrawing XM unalateraly
but for making concessions when the strength of the United States was at its
could
peak in Vietnam and le thought that a mutual withdrawal be arranged
that would have been acceptable toboth sides. He was in favor of a negotiated
settlement, but one in which the United States got everything that it could.
Whether or not the North Vietnamese would have accepted this kind of a bargain
at that time, Lake says, no one will ever now know. Lake says that his
approach was in general similar to that that was set forth by Clark Clifford.
He was not simply for getting out, but for using all the chips we had to get
out in anadvantageous way. There was great division within the administration,
Lake recalls, over the Vietnamp: policy, Laird was in favor of Vietnamization,
Rogers, on the other hand was in favor of making more of an effort to get out
and would have been prepared to make more concessions to get out. However,
Kissinger quickly established ks his dominance over Vietnamese policy and-
LIBRARY GERALD ? FORD
Vr
the entire Vietnam war was soon being run out of Kissinger's shop, although
Vietn -amization did come from Laird and that was the policy W that was adopted.
favored
Kissinger actually more of a bargaining strategy than the policy that was
decided on so in that sense his dominance was not so complete as all that.
(2r-favally)
Kissinger's general dominance over foreign policy was simply emerging during
the time that Lake was there Lake left the administration at the time of
the Cambodian invasion in 1970.
Kissinger and Nixon had broadly similar world views, Lake believes
It is not entirely true that Nixon was the strategist and Kissinger the
tactician because Nixon got into the planning of the tactics while Kissinger
N-K
had strategic thoughts. The exact relationship between them is now very difficult
to determine, Lake says, because Kissinger was always very careful not to reveal
what He and Nixon a had discussed in private. Kissinger's aim, Lake says, was to
seek stability in the worldy his approach was not so much idelogical as of trying
to maintain a stable balance of power* it is true that the Soviets were looked on
as the enemy ) but there was little sense of the Nixon administration of crusading
Cimi
for freedom among peoples under communist domination. Lake feels that as a
liberal I he in a sense feels more concerned over the internal situation in the
Drun
communist countries than Kissinger does. Lake says that he feels that he has in
a way more in common with Goldwater type conservatives than with XXXXX men like
"
Kissinger and K Nixon whom he says do not feel " in here about the evils of
communism. Lake concedes that Nixx Nixon may have felt something like that though
in a different way.
- 4 -
Nissinger and Kissinger thought of the Soviets as the ***** enemy rather
Drnr. than as oppressors of their own people. Kissinger 's approach, Lake says
was a classic diplomatic appe approach. one of avoiding extreme change, of maintaing
says that he feels
the status-quo inso far as was possible. Lake/feels that Kissinger did not fully
recognize that neither the Mate United States XI nor the Soviets now have as
much power in the world as they used to have. Lake says that he had nothing in
the administration while he was serving in it NXX about the\evolution of power
or sophisticated theories such as that. He says escentially k Kissinger had a
K
strain of pessimism about the fate of the United States of he felt that the
psmsmi foreign policy establishment had deserted him and that the **** country lacked
the will to fulfill its responsibilities as a great power. Lake thinks that
M Nixon had less of this pessimism. Lake himself feels that such pessimism is
very danger leaging to development of nationalism, too much looking inward.
FORD & 0ERALD LIBRARY