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White House - Congressional Leadership Meeting, 3/11/69 (includes minutes)
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White House - Congressional Leadership Meeting, 3/11/69 (includes minutes)
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Robert T. Hartmann Papers
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These documents were scanned from Box 106 of the Robert T. Hartmann Papers at the Gerald R. Ford Presidential Library.
CONGRESSIONAL LEADERSHIP AGENDA
March 11, 1969
Kennely Rognoo Imayo
8:30 - 8:50 a.m.
I Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty
8:50 - 9:10 a.m.
II Debt Ceiling Increase
9:10 - 9:30 a.m.
III International Development Association
9:30 - 9:40 a.m.
IV Senate Report
9:40 - 9:50 a.m.
V House Report
GERALD LISRARY 4. FORD
DIARY OF WHITE HOUSE LEADERSHIP
MEETINGS -- 91st CONGRESS
March 11, 1969
The President entered at 8:40 a.m. The first item on the
agenda was the Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty. Aiken
said that it was in better shape than a month ago and that
he expected it to be ratified by a substantial vote. He
said the problems arise as to Article 3 concerning inspec-
tion, Article 5 concerning subsidies to international mining
enterprised, Article 6 involving the ABM and a question
concerning the right of nonsignatories to pursue develop-
ment of peaceful applications of nuclear energy."
RMN inquired about the Stennis reservation and said that
hethoped that it would not pass. Aiken said that he felt
it would not if a vote could be reached this week before
some of the Treaty's supporters leave for Bermuda next
week. Rogers said that in any event, the treaty involves
no additional commitment in the security field. Dirksen
guessed theat Republican Senators would support the
treaty 2 1/2 or 3 to 1. Tower may offer a reservation to
maintain the NATO option, but he will vote against ratifi-
cation.
John Byrnes explained the action of the Ways and Means
Committee on the debt ceiling increase and the facts more
fully set out in the attached data sheet. Dirksen asked
Williams if there would be any trouble in getting action in
the Senate Finance Committee. Williams said there would
be no trouble in getting action. He did not say what kind.
Byrnes pointed out that the $5 billion outlin the President's
temporary ceiling request was in contingencies. He traced
prior votes of Republicans in Congress during Democratic
administrations; this showed almost all Republicans in
opposition to requests for debt ceiling increases. Ford
said that a current whip check shows among Republicans,
69 for, 47 against, 38 undecided and 36 absent. Hopefully,
among the undecided and absent, enough votes can be found
GERALD LIBRARY R. FORD
2
to increase the Republican contribution to 110. This means
that we will need about 100 Democratic votes. Byrnes
recalled that the Committee vote was unanimous and feels
that we could expect Democratic support. Arends inquired
if anyone knew what attitude the 100 Democratic liberals
can be expected to take. No reply. Kennedy underscored
the importance of favorable action. He said that present
figures show that we will pierce the present ceiling April 15,
in which case, it will be impossible even to pay employees'
salaries. Dirksen said that Republican votes during the
Democratic Administration were not so much votes against
the debt ceiling increase as votes in protest of unnecessary
spending. RMN noted that this is the mement of truth for
Republicans in the House, and the question is whether we
would rather switch than fight. Rhodes expressed the hope
that the Administration could make a public announcement
of some economy measure to give Republican House Members
something to hang their hats on when they support a debt
ceiling increase. Mayo said that outs will be made but
that they will look small, because Johnson's spending
projections were deliberately underestimated and revenue
projections deliberately overestimated. RMN said that the
public must be made to understa nd the true budgetary picture.
This means that any Budget message he sends to Congress
must correct the Johnson underestimation and overestimation
and then show outs from that. Otherwise, we can "cut a
billion dollars and still come up with the same net figure."
Williams+will support the debt ceiling increase, but he
criticized the Secretary of the Treasury and Budget Bureau
Director for "carrying on the farce that the budget will show
a surplus." Rather, he said that leaving aside the surplus
in trust funds, the administrative budget for FY69 shows a
$7 billion deficit, and for FY70, a $10.5 billion deficit. He
said that Democrats in the Senate will try to hold the ceiling
increase to $6 to $8 billion in order to make it necessary for
the Administration to come back several times for additional
increases. Kennedy said that the Administration must take a
stronger position and cut spending depper to control inflation.
FORD is LIBRARY BERALD
3
Professor Burns suggested that prefatory work begin now
on a fiscal message to the Congress explaining the true
picture the Administration faces. Smith said that the
Rules Committee will meet this afternoon to decide
whether the bill would be considered this week or next.
He suggested that it is inconsistent for the Administra-
tion to support an increase in IDA in the House one day
and ask for a debt limit increase the next. Ford sug-
gested that the Administration should propose some
realistic reduction in AID before debate begins on IDA.
He said that the Congress was certain to cut any request
that might be made and the Administration might as well
make the cut first.
Widnall said he was more optimistic about the prospects
of the IDA bill than Ford. The vote in Committee was 30
for, 2 no and 1 absent. Since then, two Republicans have
indicated that they may vote no. He reminded that IDA
had been established originally under Ike. All funds are
now committed. America's share is dropped to 40%.
Ford reviewed votes cast by Members of the 91st Congress
during previous Congresses; the conclusion was that a
small majority were opposed to IDA. He said that 84 new
Republicans have never voted on the issue. RMN said
that the multilateral approach provided by IDA is better
than the individual-grant technique and urged that Republi-
cans support the legislation this week. Adair said that some
Republicans regard IDA as backdoor foreign aid, essentially
for the benefit of India and Pakistan. Currently, they
receive 71%. Under the new bill, the share they receive
will drop to 51%.
The President asked what the Senate cared to consider.
Dirksen mentinned ABM and Peru. Rogers said that he is
encouraged by his talk with President Valesco Alvarado
concerning the new American emissary, Jack Irwin. The
problem is that Peru does not think we are serious about the
Hickenlooper Amendment. RMN said that had he been in
FORDO is LIBRARY GERALD
4
the Senate, he would have supported the Hickenlooper
Amendment because he believed in its concept and
purpose. America must be firm in insisting upon fair
payment for American property expropriated by foreign
governments.
Dirksen raised a question about S. Res. 85 introduced
by Fulbright. This resolution requires legislative approval
of foreign commitments made by the President and Secre-
tary. He said that this violates the Constitutional con-
cept of separation of powers. RMN said that having served
in both Houses of the Congress, he can appreciate this
concern about the executive branch commiting the nation
to secret obligations. Aiken said that the concern is not
that such agreements will be made by the President or
Secretary but by lower echelons. Rogers said that if the
Senator would give him thenmame of such a person at such
a level, he would not be working the next day.
The President asked for a House report. Ford said that he
hopes the Bluse will pass the Reorganization Act Extension
by the end of next week.
RMN said that he realizes that the Administration's legisla-
tive requests pose many difficulties for the legislative
leadership. He said that he would not "ride hard" on
individual Republican Members because he knowe their
problems. He suggested that the leaders appeal to
individual members to support the Administration on the
first battles, even if this involves "turn-arounds" and
requires them to "hold their noses."
RMN said that Dirksen and Ford could tell the press that
we had discussed the items listed on the agenda but that
the subject of ABM had not been raised. However, a
decision is expected to be announced this week. Dirksen
asked if this means that we should "just weazle out"?
RMN inquired, "Is this too difficult for you, Ev?"
RICHARD H. POFF
FORD VIDRAST
FOR INVEDIATE RELEASE
MARCH 11, 1969
OFFICE OF THE WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY
THE WHITE HOUSE
PRESS CONFERENCE
OF
SENATOR EVERETT MCKINLEY DIRKSEN,
CONGRESSMAN GERALD R. FORD, AND
RON ZIEGLER, PRESS SECRETARY TO
THE PRESIDENT
AT 10.08 A.M. EST
SENATOR DIRKSEN: We will talk about three things
that have been submitted by the President to the Congress.
I shall allude to the Treaty and Representative
Ford will talk about the debt and the International Development
Association.
There is not too much to be said about the Treaty that
you don't already know. It is in the course of discussion
now. Just when that will be completed on the Senate Floor
remains to be seen. It could conceivably go over into next
week, partly because there will be some absentees on some
official missions at the end of this week.
I have had a bit of a nose count made so far as our
side goes, and I would guess that we will have at least a
2-1/2 to 3-to-1 vote in favor of the Treaty. So, unless all
signs fail, I anticipate no difficulty in getting the
necessary two-thirds for its ratification.
So that is about the whole Treaty story for the moment.
0
Are you speaking just of the Republicans?
SENATOR DIRKSEN: That is correct, because I
don't undertake to count noses on the other side. That is
not quite my function and it might very well be resented. But
I think the Treaty is in a comfortable position now and it
ought to be, because I think it is an acceptable Treaty.
There is one reservation pending, one understanding
both by Senator Ervin -- and I believe Senator Tower proposes
to over a reservation; perhaps, he may finally decide not to do
SO.
But that is the whole Treaty story for the moment.
I will let Jerry tell you about what is taking
place over on the House side so far as the debt ceiling is
concerned and the International Development Association.
CONGRESSMAN FORD: Thank you very much, Ev.
According to the Whin Notice, we have an
International Development Association program for tomorrow
and the debt limitation legislation for Thursday.
&
MORE
È
(OVER)
GERALD
- 2 -
I understand there may be some delay until next
week on the Debt Limitation Bill. But, taking that up first--
because it was programmed in the discussion initially--under
the budget submitted in January by the outgoing Administration
it was perfectly obvious as a mathematical fact that there
had to be an increase in the debt limitation.
The House Committee on Ways and Means has recommended
a debt ceiling on a temporary basis up to $377 billion--$5
billion less than that recommended by the Administration--with a
fallback to a permanent debt limitation of $365 billion a year
from this June 30.
It is our feeling that the Republicans in the House
will, in better than a majority, vote for the increase in
debt ceiling as recommended by the Committee on Ways and
Means. It is just a mathematical need and necessity.
We are still operating, as all of you know, with the
fiscal situation in the past and the budget as recommended
by the outgoing Administration.
The International Development Association calls for
a $480 million subscription by the United States over the
next three years. This legislation was initiated by the
Eisenhower Administration in 1960. It was reaffirmed again
in 1964. It is a bilateral approach to the Foreign Aid Program.
Under the bill, as we have before the House tomorrow,
it will call for a reduction in the United States' contribution
from 42 percent to 40 percent, which is an improvement even
though the United States still makes a substantial contribution.
Here. again, I think we will get good Republican
support for the legislation and I think it will be approved.
?
Congressman, when will the President have to
ask for another debt increase?
CONGRESSMAN FORD: The reduction from the President's
request from $382 billion to $377 billion, I think, makes it
very, very tight as far as the handling of our Federal fiscal
affairs is concerned for the next 18 months.
If we are able to make some reductions in expendi-
tures and if the estimates submitted in the budget in January
for revenues are valid, the Administration can get Ey, although
it is going to be very tight.
But under even the most optimistic circumstances,
using. the figures coming out of the Committee on Ways and
Means, I think we will have to have another increase, probably
a year hence.
Q
Congressman Ford, what were the leaders told
this morning about the ABM?
CONGRESSMAN FORD: We were told, Mr. Oberdorfer, that we
will have a message from the President sometime this week, but
we were given none of the details as to what to anticipate.
MORE
FORD LIBRARY
- 3 -
Q
Is that a message to Congress?
CONGRESSMAN FORD: I understand it will be a statement,
not a message to the Congress.
Q
Will it be a statement made to the Congress
or will it be made to the general public?
CONGRESSMAN FORD: I would rather have Mr. Ziegler
answer that.
MR. ZIEGLER: As we firm that up we will be giving
you that information.
Q
I wonder if the two leaders would care to
give us their opinion on the ABM and how they feel about it?
CONGRESSMAN FORD: Speaking for myself, in the
past I have supported the decisions of the previous Administra-
tion. I am reserving judgment to see what the new President
recommends in this regard. I can trace the history, having
been on the Defense Subcommittee on Appropriations for
12 years, going back as far as 1953 when we started the
first studies in an anti-ballistic missile system. I would
prefer to make no further statement until we have heard what
the President, himself, is recommending.
Q
Senator Dirksen?
SENATOR DIRKSEN: Well, I think there ought to be
a little clarification. There was a tendency to believe that
the money that was provided heretofore was "no-vear" money.
I think that is a mistake. They are going to ask for
authorizations for military construction and procurement and then
ask for appropriations. There is roughly $1-1/2 billion in
the instant budget, assuming, of course, they are going to
go along with the program as originally laid out. But that
is a matter for the President to first determine, I believe.
There may be variations of what has been submitted
heretofore. Consequently, I don't think anything authoritatively
can he pronounced on the subject at the moment.
Q
Did the President indicate when the statement
might be coming?
SENATOR DIRKSEN: No, he didn't. He just said
"this week." And I think you ought to make allowances there, too.
Let's assume, for example, that he is going to meet with the
National Security Council or take counsel from other sources.
Obviously, that takes a little time. It is a highly important
matter.
So, when you say "this week," it could go over
GERALD LISSANY P. in
into next week. So, I think, due allowance has to be made.
0
Senator, I don't fully understand your clarifi-
cation on the budget considerations on the ABM. Are you saying
if the President decides to go ahead with the manufacture
and deployment, it will take a considerable increase ---
SENATOR DIRKSEN: I didn't say that, no.
C:
--- in the appropriation or would the billion
and a half that is now in the instant budget be sufficient to
cover that?
MORE
(OVER)
- 4 -
SENATOR DIRKSEN: That I can't answer. I am trying
to make clear that you can get information from various
sources. There was some belief that it was "no-year" money
and they needed no new authorizations. Well, you do need
authorizations for both construction and procurement.
Then, of course, you have to set yourself to the amounts that
are 20 in the budget at the present time.
Q
Have either of you taken soundings in the
Senate or the House as to what the sentiment is on these
various aspects?
SENATOR DIRKSEN: You can take. informal soundings,
but obviously you can get no conclusive answer.
CONGRESSMAN FORD: My judgment in the House is that
if the President recommends the procurement and the deployment
of a system -- without pre-judging what the system will be --
that the House will support the decision.
0
Did the President indicate whether he has made
up his mind yet about the ABM?
SENATOR DIRKSEN: He did not.
Q
Mr. Ford, I am sorry, if the President comes
in and doesn't specify which kind of system he wants, the
chances of getting it through the House would be increased?
CONGRESSMAN FORD: The chances would be improved
if we had a categorical determination as to the kind of
a system. I think it would be unwise to go any further
in commenting than that.
0
I didn't quite understand what Senator Dirksen's
view was, himself, towards the ABM.
SENATOR DIRKSEN: I uttered no view. I am like
a man on a jury, I wait for all the evidence to be in,
because it is a highly sensitive and extremely important
matter. So wait until all the evidence is in and then I
will tell you.
Ω
I wondered, in the light of what Senator
Dirksen has said, if we could move up the 11 o'clock briefing
and ask one question of Nr. Ziegler.
MR. ZIEGLER: I will be happy to answer your
questions as soon as, Congressman Ford and Senator Dirksen
conclude. The schedule is very tight.
Q
Did you talk about Vietnam?
SENATOR DIRKSEN: There was no discussion about
Vietnam.
CONGRESSMAN FORD: I would assume that when Secretary
Laird comes back there will be some briefing by him as far
às leadership is concerned.
MORE
GERALD FORD LIBRARY
- 5 -
?
Two or three weeks ago you said you would be
getting a tax reform message in two or three weeks. Did you
find out where you stand on that?
SENATOR DIRKSEN: Well, you know a week is a relative
thing. I will remind you of the Scriptures. It says; One
day is 1,000 years and 1,000 years is one day.
CONGRESSMAN FORD: I think it is fair to say that
we were told that within the next month there would be a number
of messages for the legislative program.
Q
On what?
CONGRESSMAN FORD: There was no discussion of the
details.
Q
Did you talk about extending the surtax?
SENATOR DIRKSEN: We only alluded to it virtually.
D
How was that alluded to?
SENATOR DIRKSEN: When you discuss the debt limit,
obviously you mention or don't mention that the surtax
is included in the receipts that you expect. Beyond that
we did not go.
THE PRESS: Thank you.
Q
Can we have Mr. Ziegler for one minute?
a
Ron, Senator Dirksen seemed to be indicating
that we would not get a statement on the ABM today ---
SENATOR DIRKSEN:
Are you going to talk about
me behind my back? (Laughter)
C
Ron, do you accept Senator Dirksen's
definition of time?
MR. ZIEGLER: I read the Scripture and I am
devoted to it.
On the whole matter on the ABM statement -- the
President has indicated that he will make a statement on
his decision on the ABM sometime this week. That is
GERALD FORD
where it stands and as we firm it up and as the President
makes final determinations on this, then, we will provide
that information to you.
Ω
Ron, originally he said "early" this week.
I am not trying to accuse him of missing his deadline, but
from our planning point of view, is it still likely to be
early this week, i.e., before Wednesday?
MR. ZIEGLER: For your planning, the President
will make a statement on the ABM sometime this week.
I
What is the chance of slippage into next week?
MORE
(OVER)
- 6 -
MR. ZIEGLER: The President has just said a short
time ago that he will make a statement on the ABM sometime
this week.
0
But the Senator said it might pass over.
MR. ZIEGLER: The Senator went on to reflect
his personal point of view.
Ω
He said it might go into next week.
MR. ZIEGLER: But I am making it very clear, I think,
that the President will have a statement on the ABM sometime
this week.
C
Can we rule out today?
MR. ZIEGLER: Yes, you can.
Q
Have you decided on a format?
MR. ZIEGLER: No, As soon as we firm up these matters
we will be providing that to you. As soon as a decision is
made you will be informed immediately.
2
Will you have another NSC meeting on the
subject?
MR. ZIEGLER: There is an NSC meeting scheduled
for this week where I am sure it will be discussed.
2
When is that?
MR. ZIEGLER: I believe it is Wednesday. I will
firm that up at the regular 11 o'clock briefing.
2
Are you waiting for Laird to return?
MR. ZIEGLER: As you know, Secretary Laird does
return, I believe, Wednesday evening.
2
Has the President made up his own mind?
MR. ZIEGLER: I would not expand on this subject
any further than I have.
2
Ron, the leaders spoke not only of the NSC
meeting, but Senator Dirksen suggested he might want to
FORD i LIBRARY GERALD
confer with other groups before making his announcement.
MR. ZIEGLER: I think the President made this
clear, Smitty, the other day in his Press Conference, that he
wanted to discuss it with members of the NSC and also
he would be conferring with other parties on the subject.
Q
Like who?
MR. ZIEGLER: I would not want to go into precisely
who the President confers with on these matters.
MORE
- 7 -
Q
Did the President study the report that was
given to Dr. DuBridge that was supposed to be completed,
the scientific report?
MR. ZIEGLER: I am not sure if this was in the matter
that he has reviewd or not, Herb.
d
But in any case, the President's public
announcements would not come prior to the NSC meeting; is
that a correct assumption?
MR. ZIEGLER: I would not necessarily indicate
that that would be a fully correct assumption. I understand
your questioning on this. The only thing I can give you is
what I said earlier, and that is that the President will make a
statement on the ABM sometime this week. Because the decision
as to the precise date that he will make this statement
has not been made, I cannot give you any further guidance
on this. If I would, I would be speculating along with you.
0
You may have an announcement this afternoon?
MR. ZIEGLER: When the decision is made, we will
provide you with the information, yes.
Ct
What will be the format on that statement,
Ron? Do you expect him to go before live TV?
MR. ZIEGLER: I just don't know. The decision
on this matter, as I said, has not been finalized by the
President.
At 10:45, the President will greet the Easter
Seal Girl.
At 11 o'clock, we will have the regular 11 o'clock
briefing.
END
AT 10:35 A.M. EST
FORD & LIBRARY GERALD
THE WHITE HOUSE
3/1
Hmest differences - understand
Johnson budget memord
more Prestage from white House,
/
No surpline 17 bellin
defeat
I
69
7+ in 69
Raise lebt lemit to
GERALD R. FORD
finance a sumplus
"credebility gap"
Marfid Budyet /adminatustive
Tax Return - no 10% budget surcharge.
THE WHITE HOUSE
WEEK Pay Increase 1
NEXT:
Eventive
LIGHTS GERALD : FORD
/
PERU - Apec Enrossay $
80 million
-
Kennedy / Rogro /Mayo
Tegoslation Program - next month
ABM - not subject
PERIOD - February 18 to March 10, 1969 (inclusive)
HOUSE ACTION
Tues. Feb. 18 - Un-American Activities
By a record vote of 305 yeas to 79 nays the House adopted H. Res. 89, to
change the name of the Committee on Un-American Activities to the Committee
on Internal Security. The previous question was ordered by a record vote
of 262 yeas to 123 nays.
Tues. Feb. 18 - Internal Security
The House adopted H. Res. 251, electing Members to the Committee on Internal
Security and referred matters formerly before the Committee on Un-American
Activities to the Committee on Internal Security.
Wed. Feb. 19 - Investigative Authority
Resolutions regarding committee investigative authority were called up and
agreed to for the following committees: Public Works, Merchant Marine and
Fisheries, Education and Labor, Science and Astronautics, Banking and
Currency, Agriculture, and Foreign Affairs.
Wed. Feb. 19 - Communications Satellite
Under a unanimous consent request, the House passed, with an amendment,
H.R. 4214, to amend the Communications Satellite Act of 1962 with respect
to the election of the board of directors of the Communications Satellite
Corp. This passage was subsequently vacated, and a similar Senate Bill,
S. 17, was passed in lieu, after being amended to contain the language
of H.R. 4214 as passed.
Wed. Feb. 19 - Beauty Parlor
The House agreed to H. Res. 258, providing for a Select Committee on the House
Beauty Parlor Operation. Subsequently, the Speaker appointed as members
of the select committee Representatives Griffiths, Green of Oregon, and May.
Tues. Mar. 4 - Manpower and Training Act
Under unanimous consent, but considered as if in the Committee of the Whole
House, the House passed by voice vote H.R. 497, to amend section 301 of
the Manpower Development and Training Act of 1962.
-2-
PROGRAM AHEAD
Wednesday
- Committee Funding resolutions from House Administration
H. R. 33 - To provide for Increased Participation by the United States
in the International Development Association, and for other
purposes (subject to a rule being granted)
Thursday
H.R.
- Establish limitation on National Debt (subject to a rule being
-
granted)