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May 29, 1975 - Ford, Kissinger, Portuguese Prime Minister Goncalves
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1553095
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May 29, 1975 - Ford, Kissinger, Portuguese Prime Minister Goncalves
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Memoranda of Conversations (Nixon and Ford Administrations)
Ford Administration Memoranda of Conversations
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Portugal
North Atlantic Treaty Organization. (4/4/1949 - )
Communism
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1975-05-29
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1975
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1975-05-29
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1975
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File scanned from the National
Security Adviser's Memoranda of
Conversation Collection at the
Gerald R. Ford Presidential Library
SECRET/NODIS
MEMORANDUM OF CONVERSATION
Time: May 29, 1975
3:30-4:30 p.m.
Place: Ambassador Firestone's
residence, Brussels,
Belgium
SUBJECT:
Meeting with Portuguese
PARTICIPANTS: Portugal:
Prime Minister Goncalves
Admiral Rosa Continho
F. Magalhaes Cruz, Ministry of Foreign Affairs
S. Sacadura Cabral, Ministry of Foreign
Affairs
Commander Duarte Lima, Chief of Cabinet of
Admiral Continho
Y. Maltos Procuca, Prime Minister's Cabinet
U.S.:
The President
Secretary of State Kissinger
Counselor Sonnenfeldt
Lieutenant General Scowcroft
Assistant Secretary for European Affairs
Hartman
U.S. Interpreter
DISTRIBUTION:
President:
Mr. Prime Minister, I want you to know how
encouraged we are by the change that has
taken place from the former regime in
R FORD
GERALD LIBRARY
DECLASSIFIED
SECRET
E.O. 12958, Sec. 3.5
XGDS
State Dept. Guidelines State 3/9/04
By
, NARA, Date 5/17/04
SECRET- XGDS (3)
CLASSIFIED BY: HENRY A. KISSINGER
SECRET/NODIS
-2-
in Portugal. I would very much like to
have from you your appraisal of the situa-
tion in Portugal and some indication as far
as you are concerned about your feelings on
NATO.
Goncalves:
First of all in all frankness let me say
that we are not a trojan horse in NATO. As
we have publicly stated, we will stand by
our commitments and abide by our obligations
in NATO. We feel that this is particularly
important and we do not pretend that there
should be a change in the balance of power.
On the contrary, we believe that by
maintaining the balance of forces, the situa-
tion can be improved. What we want is a
national independent policy and we believe
that such independence goes hand in hand with
an improvement in relations but not if the
balance of forces is changed. We recognize
the geopolitical context in which we fit. We
are Europeans but we also have special ties
to our former African territories. We feel
that we can make a contribution by becoming
a link between the developed countries and the
SECRET/NODIS
GERALD
LIBRARY
SECRET/NODIS
-3-
less developed countries in Africa. But
I wish to stress again, that we are here to
show that we abide by our commitments and
that we do not wish to weaken NATO. Our new
democratic regime in Portugal in fact, gives
NATO a better overall impression than it had
with the old regime.
President:
The United States has strongly supported NATO
as an alliance of free governments working
together. We have invested much in this
healthy relationship. The alliance was created
to resist communism. We do not agree with the
form or operations of the previous government
and we are encouraged by the growth of demo-
cracy in Portugal. We were greatly encouraged
by the vote in the referendum and feel that it
is a genuine expression of the will of your
people -- an expression of will that occurred
for the first time in many years. This is most
encouraging to us. We believe that the voice
of the people should be reflected in your
government and we hope that your government
will be a good partner in NATO. We are con-
cerned, however, that the vote does not seem
to be reflected by some elements and that
?
SECRET/NODIS
GERALD
SECRET/NODIS
-4-
therefore, the potential exists that some
elements will not be as good a NATO partner.
Goncalves:
Mr. President are you referring to the
presence of communists in the government?
President:
Yes, specifically and this bothers us in
NATO which was formed to meet the challenges
of communism. This does not mean that we do
not appreciate the progress made in detente
too. What concerns us is that communist
influences in Portugal will be reflected in
NATO itself.
Goncalves:
But that does not happen. The process is
very complicated and it would take me some
time to explain fully but let me try in a
few words. With regard to the Treaty and
the secrecy involved, we are now in a period
of transition. It has been accepted by all
political parties in our country that politi-
cal power is separate from military power.
The President is a military man and he wears
another hat as chief of the joint staff --
therefore on all matters dealing with NATO
and military affairs they are run through
SECRET/NODIS
GERALD
SECRET/NODIS
-5-
this system. Then there is the provi-
sional government. It also happens that
I am a military man but all military matters
run outside the provisional government.
There is a clean cut separation. On top of
this structure there is the Council of the
Revolution which is composed only of military
men. The Chairman of the Council is also
President of the Republic. There can be no
confusion about this and there will be no
interference in NATO. What I am stating is
the policy of the Council of the Revolution
and of the provisional government. The com-
munists have never raised any problems about
these arrangements. They support our main-
taining our international agreements and
commitments. The Portuguese people and the
coalition government have accepted these
facts. We would not be able to stay in NATO
if it were otherwise.
President:
You can appreciate that we cannot tolerate a
communist influence in NATO.
SECRET/NODIS
GERALD ? FORD
SECRET/NODIS
-6-
Goncalves:
There will be no such influence. Those
who know can tell you this. You must
also take account of the fact that the
Council of the Revolution is composed
only of military men who have their own
ethics. They will be concerned about the
welfare of our commitments.
President:
Are you saying that there are no communists
in the Armed Forces and therefore you are a
reliable member of NATO.
Goncalves:
You can rely on the military entirely.
Our enemies have brandished the communist
scarecrow. Of course, there is a struggle
among the political parties. But our
majority does not permit this struggle to
affect the operations of the military part
of our government.
President:
Are you saying that the Armed Forces Movement
is free and clear of communist influence?
Goncalves:
Yes, we have political positions that are
divorced from any party.
Secretary:
May I ask a question? The complexity of
the system you describe is beyond anything
SECRET/NODIS
GERALD
SECRET/NODIS
-7-
I studied as a political scientist.
Why are communists in the government?
Why is there pressure to take communists
into the cabinet if there are no commun-
ists in the Armed Forces Movement?
Goncalves:
The Armed Forces Movement (AFM) is
strongly non-partisan. The military when
we started the AFM committed on their honor
to carry out a national program which would
be anti-fascist and it would improve the
standard of living of the poor people. The
military agreed that they would have no
party affiliation and that there would be
democratic forces organized to carry out
the program. The Armed Forces Movement
program has been accepted by all the parties
allowed in the provisional government.
President:
When do you expect the provisional govern-
ment to become an elected government?
Goncalves:
This present government is democratic. It's
carrying out a campaign to fight on all
fronts to improve the economy, education,
etc. Experience shows that you cannot turn
FORD
a
GERALD
SECRET/NODIS
-8-
over our country to political parties
without a transition -- they need the
AFM. So, the real situation is as follows:
The Armed Forces Movement is established
to carry out and assure change. Then there
are the political parties and that is the
reality of Portuguese life. We are now
framing the next constitution.
President:
Who controls the government and what is
the timetable to move toward democracy?
Concalves:
I believe this has all been described in
the press. You may have heard that there
was a pact agreed between the AFM and the
political parties before the elections.
This pact provided that the new interim
constitution would have a legislative
assembly which would be freely elected and
in addition it would be an assembly of the
AFM. The salient feature of our system is
that there will be a legislative assembly
elected by the people in addition to the
assembly of the Armed Forces Movement. Both
assemblies embody our sovereignty.
FORD
?
SECRET/NODIS
GERALD
SECRET/NODIS
-9-
President:
But which body controls the government?
Goncalves:
The Council of the Revolution which is
chaired by the President and that will
continue during a transition period of
3-5 years then we will need a new con-
stitution, but that requires time.
Secretary:
As Professor of Political Sciences, I
don't believe I have ever heard of a
system which is quite so complex.
Goncalves:
It is not complex if you understand that
there is a collegial relationship between
the two assemblies and that they both report
to the President.
Secretary:
Who thought up this system? All of us have
much admiration for its complex nature.
Goncalves:
To understand it would take a while to
explanation. It is necessary to devote
time but this conversation should help to
clear the air and make it easier to under-
stand.
President:
I must re-emphasize that there cannot be
a strong NATO for the purpose which it was
formed and have communists in it.
&
SECRET/NODIS
GERALD
SECRET/NODIS
-10-
Goncalves:
I have already explained our situation.
These institutions meet our own domestic
national policy needs. But we are com-
mitted to NATO and we stand by our agree-
ments and treaties. We believe we are in
a position to contribute to an improvement
of world relations. We can help NATO to
clear the international air globally. We
believe it is necessary to stay in NATO
even though we have a different political
system. We like the Soviets and the United
States to reach agreements. We think that
the CSCE is good and that our aims are not
inconsistent with these. Our domestic
politics may be different.
President:
You can do what you wish domestically and
if the communists have no influence in NATO
you will be a stronger partner.
Goncalves:
The communists are carrying out the program
of the AFM but we have the final say and we
are aware of our own responsibilities.
SECRET/NODIS
GERALO a. FORD LIBRARY