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June 27, 1975 - Ford, Kissinger, Senator Jacob K. Javits
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1553148
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June 27, 1975 - Ford, Kissinger, Senator Jacob K. Javits
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Memoranda of Conversations (Nixon and Ford Administrations)
Ford Administration Memoranda of Conversations
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Romania
Israel
Egypt
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Middle East conflicts
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1975-06-27
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1975
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1975-06-27
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1975
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File scanned from the National Security Adviser's Memoranda of Conversation Collection at the Gerald R. Ford Presidential Library
Ed
MEMORANDUM
THE WHITE HOUSE
WASHINGTON
SECRET/NODIS
MEMORANDUM OF CONVERSATION
PARTICIPANTS:
President Ford
Senator Jacob K. Javits (Republican - New York)
Dr. Henry A. Kissinger, Secretary of State and
Assistant to the President for National Security
Affairs
Lt. General Brent Scowcroft, Deputy Assistant to
the President for National Security Affairs
DATE & TIME:
Friday - June 27, 1975
10:23 - 10:45 a.m.
PLACE:
The Oval Office
President: Are you going both to Moscow and China?
Senator Javits: Yes. With the first group. Under Henry's tutelage, I
have been wooing them and got invited.
I have been studying the Jackson Amendment. It hurts my heart that it
was fumbled -- it would have been a great achievement.
Kissinger: I think had he kept it quiet
DECLASSIFIED
NSC MEMO, 11/24/96, STATE DEPT. GUIDELINES State Deview 3/10/04
Senator Javits: I agree. And if we had kept the Ex Im limit off. That
did it. I voted against that.
E.O. 12958, SEC. 3.5
NARA, DATE 5/20/04
President: We didn't focus on it enough.
Senator Javits: It's water over the dam. I think the Romanian agreement
has an excellent chance. We are working on it. They have stepped up the
number in June and July. The Jewish group in July is going over and I
think then it will fly.
FORD
&
CLASSIFIED BY
Henry A. Kissinger
LIDRARY
EXEMPT FROM GENERAL DECLASSIFICATION
SCHEDULE OF EXECUTIVE ORDER 11652
BY
SECRET/NODIS
EXEMPTION CATEGORY
5 (b) (3)
AUTOMATICALLY DECLASSIFIED ON Imp. to Det.
SEGRET/NODIS
- 2 -
President: I hear Scoop was almost discourteous with Ceausescu.
Senator Javits: I poured oil on the waters. It was calling a spade a spade,
but you don't do that to foreigners. Ceausescu was very surprised, but
took it very well. Jackson wasn't rude, but it was very uncomfortable.
Jackson thought it would help to call a spade a spade.
I told Henry I wanted five minutes to give you the feeling of the American
Jewish Community. It is deeply devoted to Israel. Consistent with that,
it is deeply devoted to America. If the President would lay it on the line
and say this is in the American interest, it would be agonizing. If there
is no doubt that we will provide Israel with military equipment immediately.
Their worry is we will use military equipment as leverage and undermine
what they think they need for their defense. If that is laid to rest, I think the
rest is manageable.
At least 15 years ago I was in the office of Chief of Protocol in Israel and
they began to talk sensitive matters. I reminded him I was an American
Congressman and they shouldn't discuss anything in front of me they
wouldn't say before any other Congressman.
President: I think you know the way I have voted and spoken. I am a firm
friend of Israel.
Senator Javits: I know.
President: I have hundreds of Jewish friends. I am deeply convinced
an interim agreement is the best. But it may fail. The odds are not good
because of the problem of the passes. To make certain that Israel is strong
unilaterally and secure, I was far more generous than my advisors
recommended. The result is that Israel is far more secure than before
the war or at any other time. They will tell you that. There has to be
flexibility on the passes. Without them, they will be more secure than they
were before. There is no question about their military security. I don't
understand their lack of flexibility. I don't want to have to go to Geneva
but we can't have a stalemate.
I hope our good friends here and in Israel know we think it is in their and
our best interests. It is in our mutual interest to get an interim settlement.
Senator Javits: Are the Egyptians just sweetening us for the eastern end
of the passes?
FORD
SECRET/NODIS
2
GERALD
LIBIANY
SECRET/NODIS
- 3 -
President: They want our friendship and help. They want to show
independence. If they don't get it, they will be forced to go elsewhere.
Kissinger: Remember that Egypt isn't asking for the passes for them-
selves. They would be UN.
Javits: I assume that all the variables are within your command.
Kissinger: I think we can find a solution. Sadat made some additional
concessions at Salzburg to get Israel out of the passes -- including
electronic surveillance. He now thinks Israel has just pocketed these
concessions and not moved.
Javits: The American Jews think Israel is so exposed that they would
fall on the Israeli side on anything that Israel thought it needed for its
security. You have to be thoughtful on this point. American Jews have
thought that Israel was being asked to be given up ground for paper. Israel
must be in harmony with the U.S. and American Jews haven't grasped that.
They feat that our interest in the Arabs will lead us to ask Israel to make
concessions in exchange for an American moral commitment. So there is
no pressure from American Jews to push Israel to make concessions
relating to security.
President: If we don't get some movement, I have to lay the record out --
that is not good.
Javits: Rabin said they would have to reconstruct their whole defense line.
Would we help them -- give them enough to do that?
President: They would still have their main line.
Kissinger: The side issues have all been sorted out. Their mines, forward
lines and logistic installations would have to be moved -- but we would
support a jog in the line so the logistic installations wouldn't have to move.
We would support a six-month transition in the north to give them time to
reconstruct the line.
Javits: How long would it last?
Kissinger: There are two aspects. The first is that the agreement would
last until it is superseded by another agreement. That Israel knocks aside
-- and shouldn't. The other is UNEF. We can get three years there.
SECRET/NODIS
FORD
&
GERALD
LIBRARY
SECRET/NODIS
- 4 -
Javits: The crisis for Israel is the United States. It is extremely
desirable to have a settlement and not to go to Geneva. Those are the
two real points for American Jews.
Kissinger: Geneva is a lousy way to have to go. You know, it brings
all the Arabs together, brings the Soviet Union in, and forces a
consideration of all issues comprehensively.
FORD
a
SECRET/NODIS
GERALD
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NARA. DATE 5/20/04
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