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12/10/1982 (case file 115110)
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12/10/1982 (case file 115110)
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Presidential Briefing Papers
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Ronald Reagan Presidential Library
Digital Library Collections
This is a PDF of a folder from our textual
collections.
Collection: President, Office of the: Presidential
Briefing Papers: Records, 1981-1989
Folder Title: 12/10/1982 (Case File: 115110)
Box: 24
To see more digitized collections visit:
https://reaganlibrary.gov/archives/digital-library
To see all Ronald Reagan Presidential Library
inventories visit:
https://reaganlibrary.gov/document-collection
Contact a reference archivist at:
[email protected]
Citation Guidelines: https://reaganlibrary.gov/citing
19
Page 1012 TR
ID # 1/5/10
WHITE HOUSE
OFFICE OF RECORDS MANAGEMENT
WORKSHEET
X-MEDIA
H-INTERNAL
Name of Document: BRIEFING PAPERS
FOR PRESIDENT'S
Subject Codes:
SCHEDULED
APPOINTMENTS FOR
DEC1082
PR
007 - 01
1) Subject: List of invites/attendees for National
FG
006 - 12
Security Council meeting
-
-
2) Signing Ceremony for: :
FE
009 -
A) Polish proclamation (solidarity)
CO
126 -
B) Proclamation of Human Rights
HO 006 -
Day, Bill of Rights Day, and
I
Human Rights week.
I
-
3) Meeting with Senator Henry Jackson
ND
018
-
regarding MX missile logistation
LE
-
-
4) Meeting with Senator John Itennis
I
regarding MX missile legislation
ED
I
PP
5) Meeting to receive a charter establishing
011
-
-
a Ronald Reagan chair of Communications
-
at the University of Alabama
-
ROUTE TO:
ACTION
DISPOSITION
Office/Agency
(Staff Name)
Action
Tracking Date
Type of
Completion Date
Code
YY/MM/DD
Response
Code
YY/MM/DD
RMHENL
RSZ
c
Referral Note:
Paef 2072 ID # 1/5/10
WHITE HOUSE
OFFICE OF RECORDS MANAGEMENT
WORKSHEET
X-MEDIA
H-INTERNAL
Name of Document: BRIEFING PAPERS
FOR PRESIDENT'S
Subject Codes:
SCHEDULED
APPOINTMENTS FOR
DEC1082
PR
007 - 01
6) Subject: Video taping session for NBC
PR
011 -
Christmas television special
PR
016 - 01
40 016 -
7) Meeting Governoro: with three Republican
-
-
A) Robert orr- Indiana
ST 014 -
B) Richard faelling Vermont
ST 045 -
c) James Thompson- Illinois
ST 013 -
to discuss the fiscal year
FI 00/ -
1984 budget
I
-
8) Meeting with Edward ROWNY,
F0 006 - 03
ambassador to the strategic
Fo 002 = -
arms Reduction Talks
-
(START)
I
-
-
-
ROUTE TO:
ACTION
DISPOSITION
Office/Agency
(Staff Name)
Action
Tracking Date
Type of
Completion Date
Code
YY/MM/DD
Response
Code
YY/MM/DD
RMHENL
RSZ
c
Referral Note:
Def
Friday, December 10, 1982
9:00 RESIDENCE
9:00 am
Staff Time
Oval Office
(20 min)
(Baker, Meese, Deaver)
9:20 am
National Security Briefing
Oval Office
(10 min)
(Clark) VP
9:35 am
Human Rights Signing Ceremony 9:35-9:50 East Room
(20 min)
(Clark/Dole/Henkel)
(Tab A) (draft remarks attached)
10:00 am Congressional Meetings [Note: This is likely to Oval Office
(2 hours)
(Duberstein)
be reduced to approx. 1/2 hour;
11:55 - 12:10-PRESS AVAILABILITH- OVAL paper available in the a.m.]
12:00 m
Lunch and Personal Staff Time 12:15 -
Oval Office
(60 min)
1:00 pm
Meeting with Senator John Stennis 1:01-1:14 Oval
Office
(15 min)
(Duberstein)
(available in the a.m.)
1:15 pm
Meeting with Hall Thompson, et al
Oval Office
(15 min)
(Tutwiler) 1:17-1:25
(Tab B)
1:30 pm
Christmas Taping for NBC 1:30-1:42
Library
(20 min)
(Rosebush)
(Tab C) (draft remarks attached)
2:00-2:09 COEN'L Rowney & WATSON, CRANGE, BUSH, CLARK, WEINGERGER - OUAL
UP
2:00 pm
National Security Council Meeting
Cabinet Room
(60 min)
(Clark) 2:10 - 2:49
(distributed previously)
up 3:00 pm
Meeting with three GOP Gubernatorial
Oval Office
(20 min)
Leaders (Williamson) 2:55- 3.38 (Tab D)
600. THOMPSON, Oar, SNELLING BUSH, WILLIAMSON, EM, . MEAAS
Afternoon
The President and Mrs. Reagan go
Camp David
to Camp David
4:15 -
3
UNP 12/9/82
5:00 pm
THE SCHEDULE OF
PRESIDENT RONALD REAGAN
The President has seen
Friday, December 10, 1982
9:00 am
Staff Time
Oval Office
(20 min)
(Baker, Meese, Deaver)
9:20 am
National Security Briefing
Oval Office
(10 min)
(Clark)
9:35 am
Human Rights Signing Ceremony
East Room
(20 min)
(Clark/Dole/Henkel)
(Tab A) (draft remarks attached)
10:00 am
Congressional Meetings [Note: This is likely to Oval Office
(2 hours)
(Duberstein)
be reduced to approx. 1/2 hour;
paper available in the a.m.]
12:00 m
Lunch and Personal Staff Time
Oval Office
(60 min)
1:00 pm
Meeting with Senator John Stennis
Oval Office
(15 min)
(Duberstein)
(available in the a.m.)
1:15 pm
Meeting with Hall Thompson, et al
Oval Office
(15 min)
(Tutwiler)
(Tab B)
1:30 pm
Christmas Taping for NBC
Library
(20 min)
(Rosebush)
(Tab C) (draft remarks attached)
2110
for Rowny
2:00 pm
National Security Council Meeting
Cabinet Room
(60 min)
(Clark)
(distributed previously)
3:00 pm
Meeting with three GOP Gubernatorial
Oval Office
(20 min)
Leaders (Williamson)
(Tab D)
Afternoon
The President and Mrs. Reagan go
Camp David
to Camp David
UNP 12/9/82
5:00 pm
REQUEST FOR APPOINTMENTS
To:
Officer-in-charge
Appointments Center
Room 060, OEOB
December 10
Please admit the following appointments on
# 19 82
The President
White House
for
of
:
(NAME OF PERSON TO BE VISITED)
(AGENCY)
The Vice President
OPD:
Admiral Daniel J. Murphy
Mr. Ed Harper
State:
USTR:
Acting Secretary Kenneth Dam
Mr. Dennis Whitfield
Ambassador Richard Fairbanks
JCS:
Treasury:
General John W. Vessey, Jr.
Deputy Secretary R. T. McNamar
White House:
OSD:
Mr. Edwin Meese, III
-
Secretary Caspar W. Weinberger
Mr. James A. Baker III
Under Secretary Fred C. Ikle
Mr. Michael K. Deaver
Judge William P. Clark
Interior:
Mr. Robert C. McFarlane
William Coldiron
Mr. Richard G. Darman
Admiral John M. Poindexter
Commerce:
Deputy Secretary Guy Fiske
NSC:
Mr. Norman Bailey
Transportation:
Mr. William Martin
Deputy Secretary Darrell M. Trent
Colonel Michael O. Wheeler
Energy:
Secretary Donald P. Hodel
OMB:
Mr. Fred Khedouri
CIA:
Mr. William J. Casey
MEETING LOCATION
Building
West Wing White eRequested by
Carol Cleveland
Cabinet Room
Room No
Room No 372
Telephone
3044
Time of Meeting 2:00 p.m.
Date of request
Dec 10, 1982
Additions and/or changes made by telephone should be limited to three (3) names or less.
APPOINTMENTS CENTER: SIG/OEOB - 395-6046 or WHITE HOUSE - 456-6742
MEMORANDUM
THE WHITE HOUSE
WASHINGTON
December 10, 1982
TO:
DAVE FISCHER
FROM:
PAM TURNER of
SUBJECT:
Attendance at Meeting with the President
The following individuals were present at a meeting with the
President on December 10, 1982 (subject: MX):
The Vice President
Secretary of Defense Weinberger
Senator Henry Jackson (D-Washington)
William Clark
Bud McFarlene
Jim Baker
Ken Duberstein
Pam TURNER
THE WHITE HOUSE
WASHINGTON
December 9, 1982
MEETING WITH SENATOR HENRY (SCOOP) JACKSON
(D-WASHINGTON)
DATE: Friday, December 10, 1982
LOCATION: The Oval Office
TIME: 10:00 p.m. (30 minutes)
10: 24 -
FROM: Kenneth M. Duberstein KerD.
I. PURPOSE
To discuss the upcoming Senate debate on the MX missile.
II. BACKGROUND
The Senate is expected to begin consideration of the DOD
appropriations bill later today, with crucial votes occurring
on the MX on Monday. Senator Scoop Jackson (D-Washington)
who will become the new ranking Democratic member of the
Senate Armed Services Committee, is a key player in this debate.
If we are to win on the MX issue, we need more than Jackson's
vote -- we need his active lobbying among other Democrats
to assure us a majority vote.
As you recall, the House deleted $988 million in procurement
funds for the MX. It was originally anticipated that when this
measure came to the Senate, Senator Fritz Hollings (D-South
Carolina) would offer a similar amendment to cut MX procure-
ment. It is now apparent, however, that Hollings intends to
offer an even more dangerous amendment -- dangerous in the sense
it will be very attractive to some Senators who do not want
to be accused of killing the missile outright, but who have
grave concerns about the dense pack basing mode. Specifically,
Hollings is expected to offer language to fence the production
money for the missile and the basing mode until such time as
both the House and the Senate pass resolutions of approval
on the basing mode. It is very doubtful that such approval
motions would ever pass the House or Senate; therefore, for all
practical purposes, Hollings would derail the MX indefinitely,
or at least delay the IOC for an unacceptable time. Adding
to the fact that Hollings' amendment would be difficult to
beat under even the most favorable circumstances, it is also
apparent that our opponents have succeeded in translating this
vote into a referendum on the basing mode itself. Also, the
fact that the Joint Chiefs were not unanimous in their original
support of dense pack is adding fuel to our opponents' fire.
Scoop Jackson is well respected among Democrats as an authority
on defense, and is regarded generally as a "hawk" on defense
issues. He is also known as "father of the MX,' since he was
instrumental in early deliberations on this project. Jackson
supports the MX itself, but opposes the dense pack basing mode.
At the present time, although he would likely vote with us,
he is not inclined to work on our behalf. Without Jackson's
active support, we will not beat the Hollings' motion.
Our strategy with regard to Hollings will most likely be
based on an effort by John Tower to offer substitute language
calling for a freeze on production funds for the missile
through a date certain (probably April 15, 1983), or until
both houses of the Congress pass a resolution disapproving
the basing mode, whichever date is earlier. It would be
much easier for us to defeat a motion of disapproval in the
Congress than it would be for us to pass a motion of approval
which is what Senator Hollings wants.
Tower tried to enlist Jackson's support on this amendment,
but Jackson demurred. He said he would vote for Tower but
showed little enthusiasm beyond that. Jackson told Tower that
he felt we should find some way to get the Administration to
consider other basing options during this "freeze,' and
Tower has asked Jackson to come up with some language along
these lines. If Tower and Jackson can work out an amendment
that we could accept, this may be the key to bring Jackson on boar
You should not discuss any of this Tower/Administration
strategy with Jackson unless he brings it up. Politically,
Jackson is in a touchy situation with his fellow Democrats.
It cannot appear that he has been "won over" by the White
House, and in fact, if he should devise some strong language
requiring consideration of other basing modes, he will actually
be extracting more from us than we were prepared to give in the
first place. If Jackson does extract a concession from us, this
may be useful to him in lobbying his Democratic colleagues.
Since the outcome of this vote could well depend on how hard
Jackson will work with us (if he will work with us), it is
important that you specifically ask him for his help in
lobbying his colleagues on this matter.
III. PARTICIPANTS
The President
The Vice President
Senator Henry Jackson (D-Washington)
Secretary of Defense Weinberger
Staff
Edwin Meese III
James A. Baker III
Michael Deaver
William Clark
Kenneth M. Duberstein NANCY
MEKARCAND
THE WHITE HOUSE
WASHINGTON
December 10, 1982
MEMORANDUM FOR DAVE FISCHER
FROM:
M. B. OGLESBY, Roleer
SUBJECT:
Attendance at Human Rights Signing Ceremony
The following Members of Congress (House) were in attendance
at the Human Rights Signing Ceremony in the East Room
this morning with the President:
Congressman Clement Zablocki (D-Wisconsin)
Congressman William Broomfield (R-Michigan)
Congressman Edward Derwinski (R-Illinois)
CONFIDENTIAL
8430 Add-On
THE WHITE HOUSE
WASHINGTON
CONFIDENTIAL
PR
MEETING WITH AMBASSADOR EDWARD L. ROWNY
DATE:
December 10, 1982
LOCATION: Oval Office
TIME:
3.30 p.m. (five minutes)
2:00
FROM:
WILLIAM P. CLARK
I. PURPOSE
The meeting will provide you an opportunity to gain insights
on the status and direction of our latest START negotiating
round in Geneva from Ambassador Rowny, the Chief of our
delegation.
II. BACKGROUND
The latest START negotiating round has been completed and the
next round is due to begin in late January. Ambassador Rowny
will want to brief you on where we currently stand and a
perspective on what we need to do next.
After your meeting with the Ambassador, he will meet with the
press. At that time he will be able to inform the press that
he has reported to you and will emphasize the importance of
your Peacekeeper missile decision to the START negotiating
process.
III. PARTICIPANTS
Ambassador Edward L. Rowny
William P. Clark
NSC staff
IV. PRESS PLAN
On arrival, White House photo opportunity only.
V. SEQUENCE OF EVENTS
2:0-2:05
3:30 3:35 p.m. discussions in Oval Office.
Attachments
"CO
NARA,
nd
0561
'VL
in
Tab A
Talking Points
03
CONF IDENTIAL
Declassify on: OADR
CONFIDENTIAL
to ИЗДА, Sec. 3.4(b)
White House Guidelines, 1983
CONFIDENTIAL
8430 Add-On
CONFIDENTIAL
SUGGESTED TALKING POINTS FOR MEETING WITH
AMBASSADOR EDWARD L. ROWNY
-- Ambassador Rowny (Ed), I have just received your letter
reporting on Round II of START and on your suggestions
for the next round.
-- It is important that these negotiations continue to be
conducted on a businesslike, serious basis. We must
work toward the significant reductions to lower levels
which we have proposed. Your effort has been outstand-
ing, and you have our fullest support.
-- Your letter to me points out the importance of our
strategic modernization program to the achievement of
a START agreement which contributes to our national
security.
--
Our Peacekeeper and D-5 missiles and our other programs
are indeed vital. We need these systems both to restore
the balance and to provide an incentive and assurance
for meaningful arms control.
--
I know you are as concerned as I am about the impact of
the recent House of Representatives action on Peacekeeper
funding. We must do everything we can to assure that the
Congress understands the high stakes involved and provides
the appropriate funding for this program.
CONFIDENTIAL
Declassify on: OADR
DICALIFED
& 3.4(b)
White Howe Guidelines, Feb. 24, 1983
BY
CONFIDENTIAL
any
, NARA, Date 9/26/97
Friday, December 10, 1982
9:00 am
Staff Time
Oval Office
(20 min)
(Baker, Meese, Deaver)
9:20 am
(10 min)
National (Clark) Security Briefing Omb
Oval Office
amb to Junkey
9:35 am
Human Rights Signing Ceremony
East Room
(20 min)
(Clark/Dole/Henkel)
(Tab A) (draft remarks attached)
cale Rm
10:00
am Congressional Meetings [Note: This is likely to
Oval Office
(2 hours)
(Duberstein)
be reduced to approx. 1/2 hour;
/ Indian
paper available in the a.m.]
12:00 m
Lunch and Personal Staff Time
Oval Office
(60 min)
1:00 pm
Meeting with Senator John Stennis
Oval Office
(15 min)
(Duberstein)
(available in the a.m.)
1:15 pm
Meeting with Hall Thompson, et al
Oval Office
(15 min)
(Tutwiler)
(Tab B)
1:30 pm
Christmas Taping for NBC
Library
(20 min)
(Rosebush)
(Tab C) (draft remarks attached)
2:00 pm
National Security Council Meeting
Cabinet Room
(60 min)
(Clark)
(distributed previously)
3:00 pm
Meeting with three GOP Gubernatorial
Oval Office
(20 min)
Leaders (Williamson)
(Tab D)
Afternoon
The President and Mrs. Reagan go
Camp David
to Camp David
UNP 12/9/82
5:00 pm
THE WHITE HOUSE
WASHINGTON
December 9, 1982
MEETING WITH SENATOR HENRY (SCOOP) JACKSON
(D-WASHINGTON)
DATE: Friday, December 10, 1982
LOCATION: The Oval Office
TIME: 10:00 p.m. (30 minutes)
FROM: Kenneth M. Duberstein Ker D.
I. PURPOSE
To discuss the upcoming Senate debate on the MX missile.
II. BACKGROUND
The Senate is expected to begin consideration of the DOD
appropriations bill later today, with crucial votes occurring
on the MX on Monday. Senator Scoop Jackson (D-Washington)
who will become the new ranking Democratic member of the
Senate Armed Services Committee, is a key player in this debate.
If we are to win on the MX issue, we need more than Jackson's
vote -- we need his active lobbying among other Democrats
to assure us a majority vote.
As you recall, the House deleted $988 million in procurement
funds for the MX. It was originally anticipated that when this
measure came to the Senate, Senator Fritz Hollings (D-South
Carolina) would offer a similar amendment to cut MX procure-
ment. It is now apparent, however, that Hollings intends to
offer an even more dangerous amendment -- dangerous in the sense
it will be very attractive to some Senators who do not want
to be accused of killing the missile outright, but who have
grave concerns about the dense pack basing mode. Specifically,
Hollings is expected to offer language to fence the production
money for the missile and the basing mode until such time as
both the House and the Senate pass resolutions of approval
on the basing mode. It is very doubtful that such approval
motions would ever pass the House or Senate; therefore, for all
practical purposes, Hollings would derail the MX indefinitely,
or at least delay the IOC for an unacceptable time. Adding
to the fact that Hollings' amendment would be difficult to
beat under even the most favorable circumstances, it is also
apparent that our opponents have succeeded in translating this
vote into a referendum on the basing mode itself. Also, the
fact that the Joint Chiefs were not unanimous in their original
support of dense pack is adding fuel to our opponents' fire.
- 2 -
Scoop Jackson is well respected among Democrats as an authority
on defense, and is regarded generally as a "hawk" on defense
issues. He is also known as "father of the MX," since he was
instrumental in early deliberations on this project. Jackson
supports the MX itself, but opposes the dense pack basing mode.
At the present time, although he would likely vote with us,
he is not inclined to work on our behalf. Without Jackson's
active support, we will not beat the Hollings' motion.
Our strategy with regard to Hollings will most likely be
based on an effort by John Tower to offer substitute language
calling for a freeze on production funds for the missile
through a date certain (probably April 15, 1983), or until
both houses of the Congress pass a resolution disapproving
the basing mode, whichever date is earlier. It would be
much easier for us to defeat a motion of disapproval in the
Congress than it would be for us to pass a motion of approval
which is what Senator Hollings wants.
Tower tried to enlist Jackson's support on this amendment,
but Jackson demurred. He said he would vote for Tower but
showed little enthusiasm beyond that. Jackson told Tower that
he felt we should find some way to get the Administration to
consider other basing options during this "freeze," and
Tower has asked Jackson to come up with some language along
these lines. If Tower and Jackson can work out an amendment
that we could accept, this may be the key to bring Jackson on board.
You should not discuss any of this Tower/Administration
strategy with Jackson unless he brings it up. Politically,
Jackson is in a touchy situation with his fellow Democrats.
It cannot appear that he has been "won over" by the White
House, and in fact, if he should devise some strong language
requiring consideration of other basing modes, he will actually
be extracting more from us than we were prepared to give in the
first place. If Jackson does extract a concession from us, this
may be useful to him in lobbying his Democratic colleagues.
Since the outcome of this vote could well depend on how hard
Jackson will work with us (if he will work with us), it is
important that you specifically ask him for his help in
lobbying his colleagues on this matter.
III. PARTICIPANTS
The President
The Vice President
Senator Henry Jackson (D-Washington)
Secretary of Defense Weinberger
Staff
Edwin Meese III
James A. Baker III
Michael Deaver
William Clark
Kenneth M. Duberstein
- 3 -
IV. PRESS PLAN
White House photographer only.
V. SEQUENCE OF EVENTS
Senator Jackson to arrive Southwest Gate, and be escorted
from the West Basement to the Oval Office for a 20-minute
meeting with the President.
Attachment: Talking points
SUGGESTED TALKING POINTS FOR MEETING WITH
SENATOR HENRY JACKSON
-- Scoop, I appreciate your coming to meet with me on rather
short notice. By the way, congratulations on becoming the
ranking Democrat on the Senate Armed Services Committee. In
view of your long involvement in this area and your reputation
as an expert on defense issues, I know you will do an outstanding
job and I look forward to working closely with you.
-- I understand that the Senate will begin debate shortly on the
defense bill. Scoop, I really need your help on this MX
situation, and I want to get your thinking on this.
-- I understand that there may be some sort of motion to fence
production funds until both Houses approve a basing mode
decision. I cannot support that language. As you know, I
am convinced that we must have the MX missile. In fact, I
know you have been referred to as the "father of the MX,"
and so I hope you share this determination with me.
-- I am of the opinion that the Congress must have some time to
consider this basing mode question thoroughly, and I am
disturbed to hear that there are some who portray this upcoming
MX vote as a referendum on dense pack itself. I would like to
know your thoughts on the situation and any advice you have.
(Let Jackson explain his views. Do not mention
that we have been discussing this with Senator
Tower. Do not dwell on dense pack, because
Jackson opposes that basing mode.)
- 2 -
(If Jackson provides you with an option you
feel you can accept, let Jackson know that you
expect him to work this issue hard among his
fellow Democrats.)
-- Scoop, I really appreciate your advice and your taking the time
to come down here. I look forward to working with you on this,
and I am ready to lend my personal assistance in any way I can.
THE WHITE HOUSE
WASHINGTON
RR
December 9, 1982
MEETING WITH SENATOR JOHN C. STENNIS
(D-MISSISSIPPI)
DATE: Friday, December 10, 1982
LOCATION: The Oval Office
TIME: 1:00 p.m. (15 minutes)
FROM: Kenneth M. Duberstein Kar D.
I. PURPOSE
To discuss the upcoming Senate debate on the Department of
Defense appropriations bill, and specifically the MX
missile.
II. BACKGROUND
Senator John Stennis (D-Mississippi) was just re-elected to
a sixth term in the U.S. Senate. You called Stennis on
November 4 to congratulate him on his re-election. A
former Chairman of the Senate Armed Services Committee, Stennis
has indicated that he will give up his ranking Democrat position
on Armed Services, to become ranking Democrat on the Senate
Appropriations Committee. (Stennis will remain as a member of
the Armed Services Committee.) Both of these committees
play a vital role with regard to defense issues. Stennis has
been a strong supporter of the Administration on defense matters
and will remain influential in this area in the 98th Congress.
It is anticipated that the Senate will begin debate on the DOD
appropriationsbill late today, with major votes occurring
on that bill Monday and possibly Tuesday of next week. It
would be helpful for you to discuss this legislation with
Stennis and specifically the MX missile issue. Senator
Fritz Hollings (D-South Carolina) currently plans to offer
an amendment to fence the MX missile production money until
both the House and Senate have passed specific resolutions of
approval on the basing mode. With the support of Senator Tower
and others, we will offer substitute language to defeat Hollings.
Stennis has already indicated that he will be with you on
this, but you should reiterate your need not only for his
vote but also for his active support among his Democratic
colleagues.
- 2 -
III. PARTICIPANTS
The President
The Vice President
Secretary of Defense Weinberger
Senator John Stennis (D-Mississippi)
Staff
Edwin Meese III
James A. Baker III
Michael Deaver
William Clark
Kenneth M. Duberstein
IV. PRESS PLAN
White House photographer only
V. SEQUENCE OF EVENTS
Senator Stennis to arrive through the Southwest Gate, and
be escorted from the West Basement to the Oval Office for
a 15-minute meeting with the President.
Attachment: Talking Points
SUGGESTED TALKING POINTS FOR MEETING WITH
SENATOR JOHN STENNIS
-- John, I know we talked briefly right after the election, and
I am glad we now have this chance to visit personally.
-- I understand you will assume the position of ranking Democrat
on the Senate Appropriations Committee. I imagine it was
difficult to choose between Armed Services and Appropriations.
Your experience and guidance in the defense area have been
very valuable to me, and I am glad to know that you will
continue to serve on both of these important Senate Committees.
-- I understand the Senate will proceed to consider the DOD
appropriations bill shortly. You know there are several
matters in that legislation of great importance to me, such
as the MX, the B-1, the nuclear carriers, and others.
-- I am particularly concerned about the MX issue. I think it
is imperative that we dispel the idea that this vote is a
direct referendum on the basing mode. I know that the
Congress needs some time to study the basing proposal as
offered, and I welcome these discussions about the viability
of our plan. However, it seems to me that what our opponents
are trying to do is kill the MX missile under the guise of
defeating a basing mode which has not even been given full
consideration by the Congress. I would like to hear your
thoughts on this, and any guidance you might have with respect
to the MX situation.
2
-- John, as always, I appreciate your input. I hope you will
be able to help me on this one by working with your Democratic
colleagues in the Senate. I am ready to be helpful in any
way I can, just let me know.
THE WHITE HOUSE
WASHINGTON
December 9, 1982
MEETING WITH SENATOR JOHN C. STENNIS
(D-MISSISSIPPI)
1:01
DATE: Friday, December 10, 1982
LOCATION: The Oval Office
TIME: 1:00 p.m. (15 minutes)
FROM: Kenneth M. Duberstein Ker D.
I. PURPOSE
To discuss the upcoming Senate debate on the Department of
Defense appropriations bill, and specifically the MX
missile.
II. BACKGROUND
Senator John Stennis (D-Mississippi) was just re-elected to
a sixth term in the U.S. Senate. You called Stennis on
November 4 to congratulate him on his re-election. A
former Chairman of the Senate Armed Services Committee, Stennis
has indicated that he will give up his ranking Democrat position
on Armed Services, to become ranking Democrat on the Senate
Appropriations Committee. (Stennis will remain as a member of
the Armed Services Committee.) Both of these committees
play a vital role with regard to defense issues. Stennis has
been a strong supporter of the Administration on defense matters
and will remain influential in this area in the 98th Congress.
It is anticipated that the Senate will begin debate on the DOD
appropriations bill late today, with major votes occurring
on that bill Monday and possibly Tuesday of next week. It
would be helpful for you to discuss this legislation with
Stennis and specifically the MX missile issue. Senator
Fritz Hollings (D-South Carolina) currently plans to offer
an amendment to fence the MX missile production money until
both the House and Senate have passed specific resolutions of
approval on the basing mode. With the support of Senator Tower
and others, we will offer substitute language to defeat Hollings.
Stennis has already indicated that he will be with you on
this, but you should reiterate your need not only for his
vote but also for his active support among his Democratic
colleagues.
III. PARTICIPANTS
The President
The Vice President
Secretary of Defense Weinberger
Senator John Stennis (D-Mississippi)
Staff
Edwin Meese III
James A. Baker III
Michael Deaver
William Clark
Kenneth M. Duberstein
IV.
PRESS PLAN
White House photographer only
V. SEQUENCE OF EVENTS
Senator Stennis to arrive through the Southwest Gate, and
be escorted from the West Basement to the Oval Office for
a 15-minute meeting with the President.
Attachment: Talking Points
8420
THE WHITE HOUSE
WASHINGTON
SIGNING OF POLISH PROCLAMATION
DATE:
Friday, December 10, 1982
LOCATION: East Room
TIME:
9:30 - 9:45 a.m.
FROM:
WILLIAM P. CLARK
I. PURPOSE
To commemorate Human Rights Week and the first anniversary
of the introduction of martial law in Poland; to sign
two documents, a proclamation on Poland and a proclamation
on human rights.
II.
BACKGROUND
The coincidence of Human Rights Week and the first anniversary
of the imposition of martial law in Poland will offer the
President an opportunity to make a forceful statement (Tab A)
on behalf of human rights globally and in Poland particularly.
III. PARTICIPANTS
See separate list at Tab B.
IV. PRESS PLAN
Open coverage.
V.
SEQUENCE OF EVENTS
At 9:30 a.m. the President will proceed to the East Room.
On stage in the East Room will be a group of 13 people --
Solidarity leaders, prominent Polish-Americans, members of
Congress and American labor leaders (list attached). The
President will make an eight-minute statement on Poland and
human rights. Following the address he will sign two proclamations
at a small table next to the podium -- one proclaiming human
rights day and week, and one declaring December 12 a day of
prayer and solidarity with the Polish people. The President
will then present a small red-and-white bouquet to a Polish
girl in native costume, asking her to place it in the cross
of flowers which is to be placed on the Kosciuszko monument
in Lafayette Park. After he shakes hands with the guests on
the stage, the President will leave the East Room at 9:45 a.m.
Prepared by: Richard Pipes/
Dennis C. Blair
Attachments:
Tab A
President's remarks
CC Vice President
Tab B
List of Participants
Ed Meese
Tab C
Proclamations
Jim Baker
Mike Deaver
LIST OF PARTICIPANTS ON STAGE WITH THE PRESIDENT
Polish-Americans
Professor Stanislaw Baranczak
Harvard University
Professor Jan Karski
Georgetown University
His Eminence
John Cardinal Krol
Archbishop of Philadelphia
Mr. Aloysius A. Mazewski
President, Polish American Alliance
of the U.S.
Mr. Jerzy Mohl
(Polish Solidarity Official in exile)
Mr. Jan Nowak
(author and war hero)
Members of Congress
Five Members -- names to be provided
Labor Leaders
Two officials -- names to be provided
BY THE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA
A PROCLAMATION
CONSIDERING THAT:
December 13 will mark one year since the Polish military
authorities, under intense Soviet pressure, put an end to
Poland's experiment in peaceful change. During this year,
the military authorities, employing force, have intimidated
and ultimately dissolved the free trade unions with which the
Polish Government had signed solemn accords but a short time
before. Thus a genuine labor movement was suppressed by a
government of generals who claim to represent the working
class. Their victory, such as it is, can only be a seeming
one. The brave people of Poland have learned during a century
and a half of foreign occupation to maintain their national
spirit and to resist succumbing to coercion. We are not
deceived for an instant that the silence which has now descended
on expressions of free opinion in Poland reflects in any way
the actual state of mind of the Polish people. The censored
press and media do not speak on their behalf. Solidarity may be
technically outlawed but its ideals of free trade unionism and
non-violent change will never be destroyed.
This weekend offers Americans a special opportunity to honor
the Polish people and to demonstrate our support for their
struggle for the right to determine their destiny without inter-
ference by dictatorships, supported and incited from the outside.
NOW, THEREFORE, I, RONALD REAGAN, President of the United
States of America, do hereby designate December 12 as a day of
prayer for Poland and solidarity with the Polish people.
I invite the people of the United States to observe this
day by offering prayers for the people of Poland and by
participating in appropriate ceremonies and activities to
demonstrate our continuing support for their aspirations for
greater freedom.
IN WITNESS WHEREOFF, I have hereunto set my hand this
10th day of December, in the year of our Lord nineteen hundred
and eighty-two, and of the Independence of the United States
of America the two hundred and seventh.
BILL OF RIGHTS DAY
HUMAN RIGHTS DAY AND WEEK, 1982
BY THE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA
A PROCLAMATION
On December 15, 1791, our Founding Fathers celebrated
the ratification of the first ten Amendments to the Con-
stitution of the United States a Bill of Rights which
from that moment forward helped shape a nation dedicated
to liberty.
The Founding Fathers derived their principles of
limited government and protection of the rights and dignity
of the individual from a belief in natural law, that
is, the concept that our Creator had bestowed on each person
certain natural rights, or individual freedoms. As Thomas
Jefferson put it, "the God who gave us life gave us liberty. "
It is with glad hearts and thankful minds that we
recognize and honor on Bill of Rights Day this great gift
to posterity by the Founding Fathers.
One hundred and fifty-seven years later, on December 10,
1948, the United Nations adopted the Universal. Declaration
of Human Rights. By jointly celebrating this anniversary
with Bill of Rights Day, we acknowledge that there is a
necessary connection between human rights and constitutional
democracy. Throughout most of history, in most societies,
individuals have been deprived of their rights. It is
usually in democracies that the rights of man have been
observed. A good human rights record is not an accident;
it flows most often from the exercise of the right to
democratic government. For this reason our Founding
Fathers spoke most often not of rights, but of freedom
and the danger of its loss. They understood that it is
political freedom that provides the soil in which other
rights will flourish.
In some countries we can take satisfaction in real
progress toward democratic government. El Salvador inaugu-
rated democracy by holding its first truly free election,
and Brazil held elections that promise a return to full
democracy. Spain recently showed the vitality of her
young democratic system by achieving a peaceful transition
of power from one part of the political spectrum to another.
But in December 1982 our enjoyment of our own Bill of
Rights is darkened by the realization that we live in a
world where many rulers reject people's simple demand to
-2-
take part in making the laws that govern them. In 1982
we are compelled to dedicate Human Rights Day and Week to
sober reflection on a great tragedy for the rights of man.
On December 13, 1981, a year ago, the Polish military
government took the course that had long been urged by the
Soviet Union and pushed back the movement toward freedom
that had been emerging in Poland. This movement was not
only workers organizing a free union. It was a whole nation
spontaneously claiming the right to govern itself.
Because of Poland's unique geographical and historical
circumstances, Poles could only claim their rights by an
entirely peaceful revolution, one that recognized realities
and gave old institutions and relationships a new meaning
rather than overthrowing them. The movement for freedom
in Poland had, and still has, this unique moderation of
outlook. It was all the more tragic and unnecessary that
it should be suppressed. In the light of history it is
surely wrong to conclude that freedom was finally crushed
in Poland in December 1981. The Polish people's love of
freedom has endured already a thousand years. It will
surely outlast the force that sought to defeat it a year ago.
On Human Rights Day, 1982, I ask Americans to reflect
on the lands that are not free, and particularly on Poland.
The events of a year ago ought to remind Americans of the
preciousness of freedom, which we sometimes take for granted.
On this day we ought to extend our deepest sympathy
and support to the people of Poland, whose freedom was
snatched from them just as it seemed on the verge of being
won. We should remind ourselves that freedom is indivisible.
We cannot protect and enjoy our own freedom if we are
indifferent to the freedom of others. We should pledge
ourselves to help the nations that are not free, including
Poland, to find their freedom once again.
NOW, THEREFORE, I, RONALD REAGAN, President of the
United States of America, do hereby proclaim December 10,
1982 as Human Rights Day and December 15, 1982 as Bill of
Rights Day, and call on all Americans to observe the week
beginning December 10, 1982 as Human Rights Week
IN WITNESS WHEREOF, I have hereunto set my hand this
day of
,
in the year of our Lord,
nineteen hundred and eighty-two, and of the Independence of
the United States of America the two hundred and seventh.
(Dolan/AB)
December 9, 1982
4:30 p.m.
PRESIDENTIAL REMARKS: REMARKS ON HUMAN RIGHTS
FRIDAY, DECEMBER 10, 1982
I have before me two documents that speak to freedom and
especially to Polish freedom. Their contents are particularly
apt at this time: Monday marks the first anniversary of the
repression of Polish freedom by the military government there.
This repression -- carried out under intense Soviet pressure
and using tactics of brute force and intimidation -- sparked
anger and sadness throughout the world. No people were more
saddened, no people were more angered than those who share with
the Polish people close and enduring ties of blood, tradition and
affection: the people of the United States of America. Before
the tragic crackdown by the military authorities, the American
people watched with approval and growing excitement the
democratic gains won by Solidarity. We observed with awe and
admiration the courage of the Polish workers as they sought to
reclaim their right to self-government and their nation's ancient
heritage of liberty. All this they did peacefully, without
shedding a drop of blood.
Those days of light and hope are over and a cold night of
repression has descended on Poland. But despite the threats,
provocations and imprisonments, the spirit of independence and
resistance to tyranny -- a spirit that has characterized the
Polish people for more than a thousand years -- still burns
brightly in Poland today.
Page 2
It is the fervent hope of the American people that that
spirit of freedom will again, someday soon, enjoy full
expression. It is the fervent hope of the American people that
the Warsaw authorities will realize, and sooner, rather than
later, that continued repression can only prolong the political
alienation and economic stagnation that characterizes Poland
today.
In recent months, we have seen partial steps taken towards
this recognition by the Warsaw authorities. Lech Walesa and a
number of other internees have been released. We welcomed the
release of these people and, of course, we hope that the Polish
government will take other actions necessary to genuinely
transform the existing climate of repression in their country.
In introducing sanctions against Poland last December, I
noted that these sanctions are reversible. This remains the
case. But I cannot and will not remove the sanctions until the
Polish government shows with its actions that it intends to live
up to the obligations it assumed when it signed the United
Nations Universal Declaration of Human Rights and the Helsinki
Final Act.
Reports reach us that further steps in this direction may be
taken by the Polish government in the coming weeks and months. I
want to stress today: the United States is prepared to respond
to genuine liberalizing actions by the Polish government. Any
such actions will be the subject of careful discussions with our
allies. I repeat: If the Polish government introduces
meaningful liberalizing measures, we will take equally
Page 3
significant and concrete actions of our own. However, it will
require an end to marital law, the release of political prisoners
and the beginning of a dialogue with truly representative forces
of the Polish nation, such as the church and freely-formed trade
unions, to make it possible to lift all the sanctions.
The United States can only respond to deeds, however, not
to words. We are not interested in token or meaningless actions
that do nothing to fundamentally change the situation in Poland
today or that replace one form of repression with another.
As I have often said, the U.S. Government and its people are
deeply concerned about the plight of the Polish people. We will
continue to supply humanitarian aid to them through such
voluntary and private relief agencies as Catholic Relief Services
and CARE. Furthermore, as I stated last December 23, "If the
Polish government will honor the commitments it has made to human
rights
we in America will gladly do our share to help the
shattered Polish economy, just as we helped the countries of
Europe after both world wars. "
As a further sign of the affection and solidarity felt by
the American people towards the Polish people, I am signing today
two proclamations. First, a Bill of Rights/Human Rights Day
proclamation that takes particular note of the current tragedy of
Polish freedom and reminds Americans and all the peoples of the
world that the fate of freedom in Poland affects the fate of
freedom everywhere. Through this proclamation, we remember today
the Polish people, the millions of others who struggle against
the brute force of totalitarian power, and all those who seek
freedom and self-rule.
Page 4
Second, I am signing a proclamation asking Americans to join
together this Sunday in solidarity with the Polish people and to
pray for the ultimate success of their quest for freedom.
Lech Walesa not long ago spoke of the "wheat that grows on
the stones" -- of how freedom sometimes grows from repression, of
how repression only serves to strengthen the determination of
those who live in the darkness of tyranny to someday be free. In
the ideals and heroism exemplified by the Polish people and the
members of Solidarity, the world has seen a splendid affirmation
of the desire for human freedom that springs from deep religious
faith.
On Sunday, let us pray then in confidence, confidence that
wheat will someday grow on the stones in Poland and other
suffering lands and that the brutal repression of today will be
remembered only as a prelude to a time of freedom, peace and
independence. This Sunday let us remember the cause of freedom,
let us -- with the Polish people and all oppressed peoples
everywhere -- remind ourselves of the words of Isaiah:
"
they that wait upon the Lord shall renew their strength; they
shall mount up with wings as eagles; they shall run and not be
weary "
(ON COMPLETION OF SIGNING OF BOTH PROCLAMATIONS, THE PRESIDENT
WILL PRESENT A SMALL BOUQUET OF FLOWERS TO POLISH GIRL IN NATIVE
Page 5
COSTUME. SHE WILL COME FROM FRONT ROW ONTO STAGE TO RECEIVE
FLOWERS. )
I understand that some of you are placing a cross of flowers
on the Kosciusko Monument in commemoration of the first
anniversary of martial law. Please add these flowers from Mrs.
Reagan and me to the cross.
SEQUENCE OF EVENTS
Polish Solidarity Proclamation Signing
East Room
December 10, 1982
FROM:
Muffie Brandon
9:15 a.m.
Guests begin to arrive the SouthWest Gate, Diplomatic Reception
Room. Dr. Pipes with NSC and the Polish Desk Officer from the
Department of State will be on hand to identify the thirteen
platform participants. These participants will be escorted
up the Grand Staircase to the platform in the East Room.
A member from the Congressional Liason office will be in the
Diplomatic Reception Room to identify and escort members of
Congress to their seats in the East Room.
All other guests may be led up the Grand Staircase and will go
into the East Room to be seated.
9:35 a.m.
THE PRESIDENT arrives on the State Floor and proceeds down the
Cross Hall to the East ROOM where he is announced. THE
PRESIDENT takes his place at the podium and will make opening
remarks.
THE PRESIDENT then signs two proclamations at the signing
table.
Following the signing, THE PRESIDENT introduces a young girl
to whom he will present a flower for the Solidarity Cross
in Lafayette Square. He will then shake hands with all
platform participants standing behind him.
9:55 a.m.
THE PRESIDENT will then depart the East Room.
All guests are led immediately out of the East Room and
down the Grand Staircase for departure out of the Diplomatic
Reception Room.
B
THE WHITE HOUSE
WASHINGTON
December 9, 1982
MEETING WITH HALL W. THOMPSON AND
UNIVERSITY OF ALABAMA OFFICIALS
DATE:
Friday, December 10, 1982
LOCATION:
Oval Office
TIME:
1:15 p.m. - 1:30 p.m.
FROM:
Margaret D. Tutwiler
I. PURPOSE
To present a charter establishing a Ronald Reagan Chair of
Communications at the University of Alabama in Tuscaloosa.
II.
BACKGROUND
Hall Thompson is a longtime supporter of yours, as well as
a Republican Eagle and heavy contributor to the Republican
National Committee. He has provided $500,000 for the initial
funding of the Ronald Reagan Chair of Communications at the
University of Alabama in Tuscaloosa. This Chair is one of
the first such awards in your name that you have received.
Hall Thompson will be joined by Governor Fob James, Senators
Denton and Heflin and University of Alabama officials.
III. PARTICIPANTS
List is Attached.
IV. PRESS PLAN
White House Photographer
Film Crew for Taping
V. SEQUENCE OF EVENTS
-- Introductions by Margaret Tutwiler
-- Presentation and Signing of the Charter
-- Photo Opportunity
-- Guests depart
THE WHITE HOUSE
WASHINGTON
MEETING WITH HALL W. THOMPSON AND
ALABAMA STATE AND UNIVERSITY OFFICIALS
December 10, 1982
PARTICIPANTS:
The President
Margaret D. Tutwiler
Special Assistant to the President
and Executive Assistant to the Chief of Staff
Hall W. Thompson
Chairman
Thompson Tractor Company
Governor Fob James
Senator Jeremiah Denton
Senator Howell Heflin
Dr. Thomas A. Bartlett
Chancellor of The University
of Alabama System
Dr. Joab L. Thomas
President of The University
of Alabama, Tuscaloosa
Thomas E. Rast
Chairman and Chief Executive Officer
of Johnson-Rast & Hays
The University of Alabama Board of Trust
William D. Sellers, Jr.
Chairman and Chief Executive Officer
of Baggett Transportation Company
Chairman of the University Capital Fund Drive
/ C
THE WHITE HOUSE
WASHINGTON
December 9, 1982
MEETING WITH: NBC Christmas Special
DATE:
December 10, 1982
LOCATION:
The Library, Ground Floor
TIME:
1:30 p.m.
FROM:
James S. Rosebush
I. PURPOSE
This taping will include remarks by THE PRESIDENT to be included
in an NBC Christmas television special to be broadcast live from
the Pension Building on Sunday, December 12, 1982.
II. BACKGROUND
The NBC Christmas television special will include events at
various sites around Washington and will be the first time that
a national audience will view traditional Christmas celebrations
in the nation's capital. The stars will include Ben Vereen,
Barbara Mandrell and the Shiloh Gospel Choir as well as Diahann
Carroll, Dinah Shore, and the United States Naval Academy Glee
Club.
The Presidential taping will be a part of the entire program.
III. PARTICIPANTS
The taping will include 15 children from 3 - 13 years of age who
will sit at the feet of THE PRESIDENT while he reads his Christmas
poem "One Solitary Life. The children belong to the members of
the White House staff: the Stewards Office; and members of the cast
of the NBC Special (Ben Vereen's son and Barbara Mandrell's 2
children.)
IV. PRESS PLAN
The NBC crew will film THE PRESIDENT in the Library with no
other press coverage.
V. SEQUENCE OF EVENTS
THE PRESIDENT will arrive in the Library at 1:30 p.m. and join the
children in front of the fireplace. He will proceed with his
remarks and the reading of, "One Solitary Life." The taping
should conclude no later than 2:00 p.m.
Attachment: talking points, remarks, and text of poem.
(Maseng/AB)
December 9, 1982
10:00 a.m.
PRESIDENTIAL TAPING: NBC CHRISTMAS SPECIAL
FRIDAY, DECEMBER 10, 1982
The first Christmas story, of course, is told in the Bible
in its account of the birth of Jesus. But the many Christmas
stories, poems and legends we tell also celebrate the love and
giving that was such an important part of His life. The story by
Charles Dickens, "A Christmas Carol," is one of the most famous.
While Franklin Roosevelt was President, he read it every
Christmas to his family, here in the White House. Tonight, I
would like to read you a piece that is a favorite of mine: "One
Solitary Life. To me, it describes the meaning of Christmas.
There was a man born of Jewish parents,
In an obscure village --
The child of a peasant woman.
He grew up in another obscure village.
He worked in a carpenter shop until he was thirty,
And then for three years was an itinerant preacher.
He never wrote a book,
He never held office,
He never owned a home,
He never had a family,
He never went to college,
He never put his foot inside a big city.
He never traveled 200 miles from the place where he was
born.
He never did any of the things that usually accompany
greatness.
While still a young man,
The tide of popular opinion
Turned against him.
His friends ran away.
He was turned over to his enemies.
He went through the mockery of a trial.
His executioners gambled for the only piece of property he
had:
His coat.
When he was dead
He was taken down and laid in a borrowed grave.
Page 2
Nineteen wide centuries have come and gone,
And today he is the centerpiece of much of the human race.
All the armies that have ever marched,
All the navies that ever were built,
All the parliaments that ever sat,
All the kings that ever reigned,
Put together,
Have not affected the life of man upon the earth
As powerfully
As this one solitary life.
I have always believed the message of Jesus is a one of
hope. If we live our lives for truth, for love and for God, we
need never be afraid. God will be with us, and we will be a part
of something much larger, much stronger and much more enduring
than any force here on earth. That's why Christmas is joyous --
it is a season of hope for every one of us. God bless you, and
Merry Christmas.
D
THE WHITE HOUSE
WASHINGTON
December 9, 1982
MEETING WITH THREE REPUBLICAN GOVERNORS
DATE:
DECEMBER 10, 1982
LOCATION: OVAL OFFICE
TIME:
3:00 p.m. - 3:20 p.m.
FROM:
RICHARD S. WILLIAMSON
Rich
I. PURPOSE
To brief you on concerns Republican Governors have
regarding the FY 84 budget.
II. BACKGROUND
Governor Robert Orr (R-Indiana) is Chairman of the
Republican Governors' Association (RGA). Governor
Richard Snelling (R-Vermont) and Governor James
Thompson (R-Illinois) are past RGA Chairmen.
At the recent RGA Conference held November 14-16, 1982,
the Governors expressed concern regarding: (1) proposed
cuts in state and local grants; (2) the rate of growth
of defense expenditures; (3) entitlement reform.
Governor Orr believes that if there are significant cuts
in state and local grants in the FY 84 budget it will be
very difficult for Republican Governors to be supportive.
Most Republican Governors have had to call a series of
special legislative sessions to institute further budget
cuts, and in many cases, tax increases. In spite of these
actions, recent revenue shortfalls have caused further
pressure on state budgets. Indiana faces a $452 million
deficit and Illinois a $200 million deficit.
Governor Thompson remained a strong supporter of you
during his recent narrow reelection victory. He
perceives difficulties, especially in the midwest, in
building a political coalition for further budget
cuts. He feels that the FY 84 budget priorities
must be determined in light of these political realities.
-2-
Governor Snelling believes that level funding in
programs to assist people in states and communities is
crucial and will silence critics of the "New Federalism. "
He believes that federal dollars should not be sent
to individual recipients but rather should be sent
to state and local governments. The apportionment
to each state should be based on a state's tax capacity.
III. PARTICIPANTS
Governor Robert Orr
Governor James Thompson
Governor Richard Snelling
Richard S. Williamson
IV. PRESS PLAN
White House photographer
V. SEQUENCE OF EVENTS
Governor Orr will begin the discussion followed by
Governor Thompson and Governor Snelling.