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November 19, 1974 - Ford, Mayor of Tokyo Ryokichi Minobe
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November 19, 1974 - Ford, Mayor of Tokyo Ryokichi Minobe
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Memoranda of Conversations (Nixon and Ford Administrations)
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Brint
Brint
SECRET
QEd /
MEMORANDUM OF CONVERSATION
TIME & PLACE:
11:00 a.m., November 19, 1974
Guest House, Tokyo
PARTICIPANTS:
Prime Minister Kakuei Tanaka
Foreign Minister Toshio Kimura
Ambassador Takeshi Yasukawa
Deputy Foreign Minister Kiyohiko Tsurumi
Toshio Yamazaki, Director General, American
Affairs Bureau, MOFA
Hidetoshi Ukawa, MOFA (Interpreter)
Akitane Kiuchi, Private Secretary to Prime
Minister
The President
Secretary Kissinger
Ambassador Hodgson
General Scowcroft
Assistant Secretary Habib
James J. Wickel (Interpreter)
SUBJECT:
President Ford - Prime Minister Tanaka -
First Meeting
DISTRIBUTION:
DECLASSIFIED
E.O. 12053 amended) SEC 8.3
MMJ MR 10-111.#8 osoetr 10/21/10
state rev 2/13/02. DOESEN 7/24/02. Nscerr 9/11/02
By dal MARA, Date 12/16/10
WILL LIBRARY
SECRET - XGDS (3)
CLASSIFIED BY: HENRY A. KISSINGER
SECRET
File scanned from the National Security Adviser's Memoranda of Conversation Collection at the Gerald R. Ford Presidential Library
SECRET
2
PM Tanaka: It was a great honor to participate in the
welcome ceremony for you this morning, Mr. President, on this
first visit by an American president during the 114 years of
diplomatic relations between our nations. It is a matter of
particular pleasure to know that arrangements for a visit to
the United States by Their Majesties are to be decided in dis-
cussions with Secretary Kissinger.
President: Thank you Mr. Prime Minister. It was a great
privilege for me to meet HIM at the welcome ceremony this morning.
I look forward to the discussions we are to have today and to-
morrow.
PM Tanaka: I might explain that welcome ceremonies for State
visitors have beenconducted at the airport up to now, but this
morning, for the first time, we have begun the practice of con-
ducting them at the new Guest House. At the airport, the people
could not easily get in to view the ceremony, but here they can
view it through the fence, from a distance. I might add that
many of the modern buildings you see in Tokyo date from the
Olympics of 1964.
President: I am impressed by the appearance of this Guest House.
It is beautiful to look at from the outside, and the restoration
of the interior is equally beautiful. I deeply appreciate the
opportunity to stay here.
PM Tanaka: The frescoes on the walls and ceilings were restored
over a period of several years by many art students who were
mobilized for that purpose. They too will be pleased at your
visit.
President: Are the frescoes of some national significance?
PM Tanaka: No, they do not depict scenes from Japanese history.
Originally, this Palace was modelled after Versailles; the paintings
are not drawn from Japanese history.
President: We think this visit has great significance, as a
reaffirmation of the close working relations between our two
countries and as an extension of the firm relations we have
developed in the past.
SECRET
SECRET
3
PM Tanaka: The Japanese people deeply appreciate the more than
century-long friendly relations between Japan and the United
States, and particularly appreciate the central role played
by the United States in the post-war period when Japan was
occupied by the Allied Powers. They know that the United
States, in its central role in the Occupation, spared Japan
the fate of such countries as Germany which was divided between
East and West. They also appreciate Japan's good fortune in
receiving a variety of assistance from the United States, in-
cluding GARIOA, EROA and Marshall Plan aid, and in being ex-
empted from reparations by the DRAPER Mission. They Japanese
people fully appreciate these good relations and the fact that
Japan's recovery from the war and its present prosperity are
due to the cooperative role played by the United States. However,
no matter how much good is done, there is bound to be some
opposition in an open society, for example, when opposition
forces prevented President Eisenhower's visit in 1960. I'm
sure, however, that you, Mr. President, and the members of
your party can see and feel for yourselves the welcome which the
people of Japan are extending to you from their hearts on this
occasion of the first visit to Japan by an incumbent President.
Surely, this must mark the highest point in the more than a
century long history of our relations.
President: We also believe this visit is most beneficial to
both countries. As you have said, we have developed a remarkably
close relationship since the war. We might consider this as a
foundation for further development in the future. We have had
relatively minor differences since the war, but these have all
been overcome. As we look at the future we can be confident that
we will continue to work together in dealing with energy and
energy-related problems, expanding programs for peace in Asia
and the world, and dealing with the many other problems we
face. Our relationship provides a fine foundation for the
better, more peaceful world we seek to to create. And so I
welcome this opportunity, today and tomorrow, to continue our
open dialogue, which contributes not only to healthy relations
between the United States and Japan, but also throughout the
world.
PM Tanaka: The very keynote of Japan's diplomacy is the maintenance
of friendly relations between Japan and the United States, and we
believe it is essential to maintain the Mutual Security Treaty,
not just for Japan's sake, but also to maintain peace in Japan
and Asia. In that sense, we believe it essential to expand
our excellent, friendly relations with the United States, in-
cluding firm support for the maintenance of the MST.
SECRET
SECRET
4
With respect to bilateral problems, direct trade between
Japan and the United States is expected to exceed $20 billion
in 1974, and it is only natural for some unavoidable frictions
to arise when contacts are this intensive. However, our ex-
perience these past two years in reducing the trade imbalance
from about $4 billion in Japan's favor to near equilibruim
demonstrates that we can cooperate effectively to restore
normal conditions, such as prevail now; therefore, I wish
to emphasize the communication between nations is essential,
particularly the continuing dialog between Japan and the United
States. Given the good relations between us there should be
no problems which Japan and the United States cannot solve, and
thereby contribute to world peace.
Secretary: Mr. President, I might point out that when the
Prime Minister took office (July, 1972) he took energetic
action to reduce the serious trade imbalance between us. He
carried out his promise to do so, which we feel was most con-
structive.
PM Tanaka: One more point I wish to emphasize, Mr. President,
is that the only country in Europe which would seem to be com-
parable to Japan is West Germany. The UK, France, Holland
and other major industrial nations can cooperatate with each other,
to maintain their joint position, while they develop contacts with
adjacent nations of East Europe and the Soviet Union: for one thing,
NATO is strong, On the other hand, Japan is close to the Soviet
Union, the biggest communist nation, and the cradle of communism.
Nearby is another large communist nation, China. The Soviet
Union, in fact, flies a reconnaisance flight, the "Tokyo Ex-
press, in the vicinity of Japan, almost daily, like a scheduled
airliner. The nearby Korean peninsula is divided into two
states, north and south, and Taiwan and China present another
problem. In that sense, the position of the West Europeans
in maintaining peace differs from Japan's, as we continue to
aspire to the maintenance of peace and democracy in Asia, and
we should approach this challenge from a different angle. As
I have noted, the maintenance of the peace we enjoy today de-
pends on the maintenance of the system of cooperation and
understanding between Japan and the United States, centered on
the MST. In comparing Asia with Europe, a number of nations
have begun to move in the direction of peace, and should do
so, but in my view the last area to which peace may come to
Asia, which is a big, poor continent, divided by religion and
race, and afflicted with population problems. If peace could
SECRET
SEGRET
5
be achieved in Asia, world peace could be maintained. I
wish to emphasize my understanding that it is essential
to maintain Japan-US cooperation for this purpose.
President: I assure you, Mr. Prime Minister, that we wish
to continue that kind of relationship, with the MST, of
course, as the basis for our cooperation. As we advance,
we may expand our efforts in other ways, for example, in
dealing with energy and energy-related problems, and handling
economic assistance to the developing countries, especially
in SEA. We consider all parts of the world to have a vital
importance. We recognize that problems in Europe are
different from the problems in our relations elsewhere. If
one looks at the record, the importance we attach to our
relations in Asia and the Pacific is fully evident; we
believe the record shows that they rank highest in a listing
of priorities. The fact that I am making my first visit
abroad to Japan indicates how strongly we feel the importance
of US-Japan relations.
As we look at the Pacific, we continue to follow the
path of developing good relations with the PRC. We feel the
historic step we took continues to benefit all of us.
I will also visit Vladivostok, to meet with General
Secretary Brezhnev, to discuss the US-Soviet detente which
aims to create stability and broaden relations with a former
adversary. Broader relations, I feel, would benefit not only
the nations of the Pacific, but also those of Europe.
My visit to Seoul demonstrates the importance we attach
to our relationship with a courageous and strong ally.
All of these visits, to the Soviet Union, China, the
ROK, and of the utmost importance, to Japan, are clear evi-
dence of the fact tha the United States feels the Pacific
is as important as any other area.
been
Secretary: Mr. President, the fact that I have/ asked to come
back from Vladivostok and Japan to brief our Japanese friends
on those visits also indicates the importance we attach to our
relations with Japan.
SECRET
SEGRET
6
President: Mr. Prime Minister, the subject of trade to which
you referred, is vitally important subject for us to discuss.
We hope to continue to expand our trade with Japan. We wish
to continue as a big supplier of an adequate food supply for
Japan. We have been greatly encouraged by Japan's purchases
of some $3 billion in agricultural products this year. Let
me say that we are taking steps to make certain that you may
continue to rely on the United States for an adequate supply
of food. Four to six weeks ago we took firm action on the
unexpected large purchases of grain by the Soviet Union, but
this problem has been worked out. We intend to keep an ade-
quate supply of food moving to Japan. We are also grateful
for the purchases by Japan, as are our growers. This administra-
tion is not going to take arbitrary action to cut off agricultural
exports; on the contrary, we hope to expand our exports.
PM Tanaka: Japan imports 90-100% of the wheat, soybeans and
feed grains it consumes, almost all of it from the United States,
and all of the Japanese people will appreciate your assurance
of adequate food supplies.
President: We are encouraging full production in the United
States. We had some disappointments this year, with a wet
spring, a hot dry summer and an early frost. But we had
the biggest wheat crop in the history of the United States,
and the fifth largest crop in corn, even though the corn
crop was not as large as anticipated. We will make a maximum
effort to expand all production in 1975. Hopefully, the
weather will be more encouraging than this year; it could
hardly be worse.
I have a question, Mr. Prime Minister, relating to agriculture.
We wish to sell as much grain as Japan wishes to buy, but at
the same time I have been under pressure in the United States
by the cattle growing industry. This is one area where the
prices are down because of overproduction, and we think it is
important to negotiate the removal of Japan's embargo against
American cattle, at the working level.
SECRET
SECRET
7
PM Tanaka: Japan's consumption of beef has been growing
for ten years, but last year a tendency toward reduced
consumption appeared not just in Japan, but also in the
European community. Wages have increased in Japan, and
there ought to be a comparable increase in beef consumption,
but instead, savings are up and beef consumption is down.
We have been importing 130,000 - 140,000 tons to meet our
needs this year, but under present circumstances have
temporarily suspended imports. First of all, there has
been a steep decline in consumption, and second, the cost
of feed grain has risen so sharply that our cattlemen
cannot afford feed to fatten their cattle. As a result,
the farmers have been asking the Livestock Agency to buy
up their calves. Even though we have halted beef imports,
the Livestock Agency finds itself with 60,000 tons of beef on
hand, all of which it bought from distressed farmers. Of
course, we would like to see the people increase their beef
consumption as soon as possible, to reduce this stock of
beef, and thus open the way to resume our normal beef imports.
Only three years ago the then Secretary Connally persuaded
us to import 5,000 feeder calves, but we couldn't get more
than 500 to 1,000 head. We have, incidentally, been import-
ing about 100,000 tons of beef from Australia and 10,000 tons
from New Zealand, and I am aware that they are turning to the
United States, as an alternative market, for the meat which
Japan and the European Community no longer import because
of declining consumption.
SECRET
SECRET
8
President: As I pointed out, this is an important matter,
which has been raised with me by the growers in the United
States. It ties in with our effort to increase agricultural
sales to Japan as a whole. It is in our mutual interest to
work things out in this area, too.
There is another area, Mr. Prime Minister, in which it
is in our mutual interest to cooperate. As I said, the
United States considers the Pacific a vital and important
area for peace, as important as any other. We have, therefore,
continued to help the South Vietnamese. We give them sub-
stantial economic aid, and continue to give them military
assistance, within the framework of the Peace Treaty. The
anticipated need for assistance in Vietnam this year is in the
range of $1 billion in magnitude. We hope to provide
substantial help, but the Congress has not been as generous
as I might wish. It is important that South Vietnam be
able to continue its recovery, and economic growth. We have
been encouraged greatly about their prospects by reports of
the discovery of significant oil deposits under the sea off
the coast of South Vietnam. Let me say that we feel strongly
that it is important that South Vietnam continue to rebuild
and strengthen itself. We recognize that Japan has made a
good contribution to South Vietnam, including a total of
about $64 million in aid this year, which we applaud. We
hope that Japan in its next FY will expand its contribution
to the recovery and rehabilitation of South Vietnam.
PM Tanaka: We fully respect the great amount of assistance
the United States is providing South Vietnam. Japan's
policy is to expand its economic and technical contributions
to South Vietnam to the maximum extent possible, since we
are unable to extend military aid. The opposition parties
in the Diet, however, strongly oppose any aid to South
Vietnam. Therefore, we have to balance our aid to Vietnam
within the context of economic cooperation with the five
ASEAN nations, Burma and Bangladesh. However, we do wish to
consider what might be possible under the AID section of the
JFY 75 draft budget we must draft by December. I assure you
SECRET
SECRET
9
that our aid for Vietnam will not be less than this year,
and we would hope to increase it to the extent possible.
President: That would be helpful. We believe that two
nations tied as closely as the United States and Japan have
a mutual interest in strengthening South Vietnam. I might
say I have been most interested in the encouraging reports
recently about the oil potential of South Vietnam, which
offers some grounds for optimism about their future.
This leads to a new subject of great mutual interest to
all of us. I personally appreciate Japan's cooperation in
energy, in the IEG and the IEP. Both are vitally important
to the consumers throughout the world. It is vitally
important for us to have a IEG and a strong IEP. We should
be prepared to move strongly, not to antagonize the producers,
but to make sure that we consumers don't have to assume a
defensive posture in bargaining with the producers without
any strength. In our judgment it is essential for Japan to
support both the IEG and the IEP firmly. I can assure you,
Mr. Prime Minister, that we will continue to give the kind
of leadership in this area, which Secretary Kissinger has
been giving. Progress up to now has been encouraging, and
we feel that anything which further strengthens the consumers
will benefit both the consumers and the producers in the long
rune.
PM Tanaka: In my view energy is the greatest problem we
face. I understand Secretary Kissinger's proposal very well.
Japan has a deep interest in the oil question, which is really
at the root of the reason many countries around the world
are eating less meat. However, I hope you understand that
Japan's circumstances differ from some other countries, like
the US, UK and France. For example, Japan has no coal; it is
dependent on oil for most of its energy. Consuming about
300 million tons of oil per year- almost all of it imported--
it is natural that Japan should try to conserve oil. However,
73% of Japan's oil is used for industrial purposes, and only
27% for private consumption. (note: Kiuchi gave PM Tanaka
these figures in writing.) By comparison, the 31% of the
SECRET
SECRET
10
United States consumption is for industrial purposes and 69%
for private purposes. Therefore, any conservation program
automatically means an immediate reduction of industrial
production in Japan. I would hope that these special
circumstances could be reflected in any program devised to
deal with the oil question.
Secretary: May I, Mr. President, comment on two problems,
consumer solidarity and the specific measures by which we
hope to attain it. In preparing my Chicago speech, I linked
consumption and the development of a new system because I
recognize the special position of Japan. Obviously, all
nations can't conserve oil to the same degree as the others,
and therefore should try to compensate by increasing their
reliance on alternative supplies. We would be prepared to
work with Japan, within the framework of our joint agreement
on uranium enrichment and other alternatives, to take into
account Japan's specific requirements relating to industrial
use in working out a conservation program for the consumers.
I can assure you this energy program is not designed for
conservation at the expense of growth, but instead is
planned to achieve the conservation of energy and growth by
also developing alternative sources of energy. If the con-
sumers could achieve greater solidarity along these lines,
it would improve their position to bargain for oil.
President: We are devoting a great deal of effort to R&D in
potential alternative sources, such as solar and geothermal
energy, and to make coal a more effective and cleaner source.
We are thinking of sharing the results of these R&D programs
as a part of the IEG and the IEP. The development of
alternative sources lessens our dependence on oil, and thus
increases our independence.
PM Tanaka: As I noted, Japan imports almost all of its oil,
and our BOP cannot continue to bear the increased cost of oil.
Therefore, the most serious consideration for us is the
development of alternative sources of energy, including
nuclear, solar and geothermal. However, Japan cannot conduct
these programs alone--all of the advanced industrial
democracies should combine their total efforts for this
purpose.
SECRET
SECRET
11
Secretary Kissinger: We would like within a few weeks to meet
quietly with a suitable official from Japan without any
public dramatics to discuss this issue. Perhaps the Prime
Minister could send someone to Washington, or we could send
someone here to discuss our thinking on this in detail,
without making any dramatic announcements. In my speech I
used forthright language to express what we think must be
done to meet this situation.
PM Tanaka: We could continue our fruitful discussions of
energy, food and the international situation tomorrow, but
if I may I would like to discuss another matter about five
minutes.
President: I agree that our discussions this morning have
been fruitful, and look forward to continuing them tomorrow,
when there would be less pressure of time.
PM Tanaka: May I? The GOJ firmly supports the MST, which
is important not just to the peace and security of Japan,
but also Asia. There is one important problem, however,
nuclear weapons. Japan and the United States began their
discussions of this question originally in the context of
strategic nuclear weapons, but now tactical nuclear weapons
have proliferated, and perhaps we should discuss this matter
from this new point of view. I can understand that the
Americans and the Europeans think about this matter in terms
of a different kind of perception, but the Japanese people
have a special sensitivity to nuclear weapons, which is
mobilized by certain political forces for their own political
ends. The question of nuclear weapons became an urgent one
for the GOJ, beginning with the homeporting of the US carrier
Midway at Yokosuka. You may say that it is difficult to
respond to Japan on this matter, because Japan's security is
assured by the United States nuclear umbrella, but nevertheless,
Japan does have a special sensitivity to nuclear weapons.
I raise this issue as one for experts from both nations to
examine closely; I don't raise it simply as an argument for
argument's sake. It presents a political issue on which the
SECRET
SECRET
12
GOJ must be responsive to the people. Therefore, following
the publication of Adm. LaRocque's testimony we requested
your cooperation, and I now wish to reiterate that request.
President: I do understand, the special sensitivities of
the Japanese people, Mr. Prime Minister, and I am familiar
with the language of the MST. We are anxious to cooperate,
and we understand your political problem. Our position is
that something could be worked out. Secretary Kissinger
will work with your people to do so, within the context of
keeping the special relationship we have already developed.
Minister Kimura: What should I tell the press in the
briefing scheduled for 3:30 p.m.?
Secretary Kissinger: You might mention both their Majesties'
visit to the United States; that the President and Prime
Minister reconfirmed the firm relationship between both
countries, including the MST; that the two leaders reconfirmed
that both nations would cooperate more closely on bilateral
and multinational issues, such as food; and that they dis-
cussed oil, the World Food Conference at Rome, my speech
in Chicago and other world problems on which both countries
could cooperate in their mutual interest.
Minister Kimura: I might say that the President gave assurance
to the Prime Minister that the United States would continue
to serve as a stable, long-term source of supply for food and
feed grains.
Secretary Kissinger: That the President expressed his hope
that Japan would remove its restrictions on beef imports.
GERALD
Minister Kimura: That the Prime Minister explained Japan's
circumstances, and his desire to resume beef imports at
some time. But I don't plan to refer to Vietnam.
Secretary Kissinger: We won't refer to the nuclear question.
Minister Kimura: That the Prime Minister expressed Japan's
wish to firmly support the MST, in the operation of which
SECRET
SECRET
13
both countries are cooperating closely. Should I say that
both sides confirmed the views they have clearly stated
many times, and that the United States understands Japan's
special sensitivity to nuclear weapons?
Secretary Kissinger: That could lead to other questions.
I plan to follow the same line as you, in my briefing at
3:30 p.m., but I would prefer to begin by describing the
importance the United States attaches to its relations with
Japan. I might also say that we explained our energy pro-
posal, and expressed appreciation for Japan's cooperation
in this area.
CERALD
James Jaw Wickel
November 23, 1974
SECRET
P/Tanaka
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copy - interpreter
19 Nov
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DECLASSIFIED
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state rev 2/13/02. DO 7/24/02 uscer 9/11/02
FORD LIBRARY
By dal MARA, Date 12/16/10
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